Doug Williams is still crying...two and a half years later


jag4life said:
I'm still wondering which rules.

For some reason I just feel that if Odums got someone to donate a brand new floor for the weight room at SU and had it installed at NO cost to SU, no SU chancellor would have a problem with it.
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Right.. I understand protocol and all of that but this ain't deep enough to get into all of that. I work for the govt too and I know you can't have outside funding without approval...but universities are not nearly as strict. There were ways to make this work. The President was simply ineffective and petty...
 
Tigerpride said:
Right.. I understand protocol and all of that but this ain't deep enough to get into all of that. I work for the govt too and I know you can't have outside funding without approval...but universities are not nearly as strict. There were ways to make this work. The President was simply ineffective and petty...
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Bingo.

And typical of any university politics, folks will take sides. I get it, hell AAMU is one of the most ruthlessly political universities on the planet. The bottom line is, presidents need to properly raise funds for athletics and market the programs the same way they do academic programs. Maybe not at the same level, but a lot of problems would be solved if ninjas would get out of that office and lift a finger for other causes every now and then.
 

Tigerpride said:
Right.. I understand protocol and all of that but this ain't deep enough to get into all of that. I work for the govt too and I know you can't have outside funding without approval...but universities are not nearly as strict. There were ways to make this work. The President was simply ineffective and petty...
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TP, you don't really believe this.
 
To make a long story short, I think Doug was fired because he did nothing on the field but lose. His son got outplayed by everyone who came in at QB and he never lost his spot unless he got hurt. We lost Frank Rivers who was our 6'-6'' QB who went on to have a good career after he transferred and he really deserved more credit the year that we won the SWAC championship than Dougs son. Doug was changing out our RB's every week but he always said it wasn't a QB battle to be had in interviews. How you only when 2 games in two years and no QB change. They can say he broke all these rules but coaches get in trouble all the time for recruiting stuff but if they are winning no one cares enough to fire them. Our team went from 2 wins in two years to 7 the next year with a new coach and just about all the same players just a new QB. Doug only kept his job that long because of who he was and not what he did. I think he was well overdue for what he got.
 
Hardwork454 said:
To make a long story short, I think Doug was fired because he did nothing on the field but lose. His son got outplayed by everyone who came in at QB and he never lost his spot unless he got hurt. We lost Frank Rivers who was our 6'-6'' QB who went on to have a good career after he transferred and he really deserved more credit the year that we won the SWAC championship than Dougs son. Doug was changing out our RB's every week but he always said it wasn't a QB battle to be had in interviews. How you only when 2 games in two years and no QB change. They can say he broke all these rules but coaches get in trouble all the time for recruiting stuff but if they are winning no one cares enough to fire them. Our team went from 2 wins in two years to 7 the next year with a new coach and just about all the same players just a new QB. Doug only kept his job that long because of who he was and not what he did. I think he was well overdue for what he got.
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IN BOLD!!!!
 
From a person who wasn't in favor of Doug being hired for a season time after he ditched the job the first time, I do feel that Doug should not have been handled the way he was handled at Grambling. Yes, we were losing and DJ couldn't seem to get the offense rolling, but Doug still should have received more respect than getting dropped that early in the season. If he was going to get canned after another terrible season, then things would have been different. A coach two years removed from a SWAC Championship Title should have been given at least a chance to finish out that season. Yes, the title was ugly, but it is better than losing. The reason for his firing was a bunch of BS to cover up the real reason for his firing.


With all of that being said, Doug needs to let sleeping dogs lie at this point.
 
Basebone1898 said:
From a person who wasn't in favor of Doug being hired for a season time after he ditched the job the first time, I do feel that Doug should not have been handled the way he was handled at Grambling. Yes, we were losing and DJ couldn't seem to get the offense rolling, but Doug still should have received more respect than getting dropped that early in the season. If he was going to get canned after another terrible season, then things would have been different. A coach two years removed from a SWAC Championship Title should have been given at least a chance to finish out that season. Yes, the title was ugly, but it is better than losing. The reason for his firing was a bunch of BS to cover up the real reason for his firing.


With all of that being said, Doug needs to let sleeping dogs lie at this point.
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Doug inherited a SWAC championship team. Doug made no effort to better the team by changing QB's so he must not have cared how Grambling looked getting beat the way we did. He won a championship with Broadway's team and got 2 wins the next two years. I respect him for what he did as a player but as a coach i didn't. Fobbs is the coach now and I'm happy with it and now we get respected and have enjoying games to watch.
 
Hardwork454 said:
Doug inherited a SWAC championship team. Doug made no effort to better the team by changing QB's so he must not have cared how Grambling looked getting beat the way we did. He won a championship with Broadway's team and got 2 wins the next two years. I respect him for what he did as a player but as a coach i didn't.
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Grambling didn't win the SWAC title in 2010.
 
Hardwork454 said:
They Went 9-2 under Broadway in 2010 and could have won the AC that year. Doug just finished up what Broadway started. The pieces already were there for a championship. And after that it all went down hill.
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They did not win the SWAC. That "pieces" talk does not carry enough weight. The man won it fair and square and won plenty before that. This "only because" talk is crazy when it comes to football. I picked Grambling to win the SWAC title in 2015 because the pieces were there. They got smashed by Alcorn.
 

SWAC&MEAC Degrees said:
They did not win the SWAC. That "pieces" talk does not carry enough weight. The man won it fair and square and won plenty before that. This "only because" talk is crazy when it comes to football. I picked Grambling to win the SWAC title in 2015 because the pieces were there. They got smashed by Alcorn.
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Words spoken by a true outsider. In 2011 Grambling won the SWAC but had 3 SWAC losses in Doug's first year. That is a miracle in its own and the team started slow because of his son. Mario Lewis was the best WR and he was a senior when Doug got there.You say the pieces in place thing doesn't hold enough weight. I do remember the G.S. Warriors winning over 20 games and no losses with Walton as the coach. Grambling went 9-2 before Doug with an 8-1 SWAC record and it's only loss came to Texas Souhern by 7. The next year with the team they had they were suppose to win it but Doug and Lil Doug almost messed that up. We all saw Frank Rivers outplay him and Anthony Carrothers got the message early and transferred out. We had no upper class QB's because they already knew what it was. They went 8-4 Dougs first year and we did win the ship but how do you go 1-10 two years in a row if it was good coaching that turned the season around and won the SWAC. Truth is the talent ran out and people left. Now don't get me wrong he was good the first time he coached but putting his son on the team and playing him from day one after all that shows that he didn't do what was best for the team. That's why some family shouldn't get involved with work. Like I said if Doug could win the first year and was so good with an already good team than why did we have one win seasons two years in a row? Say what you want Doug didn't do his job and now someone else is. Proof's in the pudding.
 
Hardwork454 said:
Words spoken by a true outsider. In 2011 Grambling won the SWAC but had 3 SWAC losses in Doug's first year. That is a miracle in its own and the team started slow because of his son. Mario Lewis was the best WR and he was a senior when Doug got there.You say the pieces in place thing doesn't hold enough weight. I do remember the G.S. Warriors winning over 20 games and no losses with Walton as the coach. Grambling went 9-2 before Doug with an 8-1 SWAC record and it's only loss came to Texas Souhern by 7. The next year with the team they had they were suppose to win it but Doug and Lil Doug almost messed that up. We all saw Frank Rivers outplay him and Anthony Carrothers got the message early and transferred out. We had no upper class QB's because they already knew what it was. They went 8-4 Dougs first year and we did win the ship but how do you go 1-10 two years in a row if it was good coaching that turned the season around and won the SWAC. Truth is the talent ran out and people left. Now don't get me wrong he was good the first time he coached but putting his son on the team and playing him from day one after all that shows that he didn't do what was best for the team. That's why some family shouldn't get involved with work. Like I said if Doug could win the first year and was so good with an already good team than why did we have one win seasons two years in a row? Say what you want Doug didn't do his job and now someone else is. Proof's in the pudding.
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I feel you... but which key contributors other than Lewis played as much of a role in 2011 as they did in 2010?
 
jag4life said:
I feel you... but which key contributors other than Lewis played as much of a role in 2011 as they did in 2010?
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We returned 15 starters for Doug's first year and we had people to take the other 9 people's place. If it wasn't for Lil Doug then we would have had a better record than we did. Carrothers or Rivers was suppose to be the QB and we would be set with that but Doug and Lil Doug almost messed that up. Lil Doug was 4-16 for 100 yards and a pick and didn't get benched in the SWAC championship game. Our RB Roberts stepped up in one of those 9 vacancies and rushed for over 1000 yards and he was recruited by Broadway and he was good but he had to wait his turn behind our senior backs in Frank Warren and Cornelius Walker.The question is who came in new and made a difference in 2011?
 
Hardwork454 said:
We returned 15 starters for Doug's first year and we had people to take the other 9 people's place. If it wasn't for Lil Doug then we would have had a better record than we did. Carrothers or Rivers was suppose to be the QB and we would be set with that but Doug and Lil Doug almost messed that up. Lil Doug was 4-16 for 100 yards and a pick and didn't get benched in the SWAC championship game. Our RB Roberts stepped up in one of those 9 vacancies and rushed for over 1000 yards and he was recruited by Broadway and he was good but he had to wait his turn behind our senior backs in Frank Warren and Cornelius Walker.The question is who came in new and made a difference in 2011?
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Doug got rid of Carrothers in the spring as soon as he got there right?

And that SCG was bad. But looking at the season's numbers, Rivers played a lot and had worse numbers than DJ (more INT, less TD, lower completion %)
 
jag4life said:
Doug got rid of Carrothers in the spring as soon as he got there right?

And that SCG was bad. But looking at the season's numbers, Rivers played a lot and had worse numbers than DJ (more INT, less TD, lower completion %)
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Carrothers played in Doug's first spring game and he didn't do great but he did do the best out of all QB's. He all of a sudden transferred and I never heard why he left in his own words but after seeing everyone else leave I think I know why but he had the most experience at QB. After he left all we had was Frank, a walk on and Lil Doug.

And the stats for Rivers didn't tell the whole story. He didn't cripple the offense and he gave us a chance at scoring. He was the type of guy that year who didn't have good numbers but he gave you a chance to win, something like Vince Young in Tennessee. i think if he had the same playing time and played in the same situations as DJ he would do better based off what I saw outside the box score stats.
 
Hardwork454 said:
Carrothers played in Doug's first spring game and he didn't do great but he did do the best out of all QB's. He all of a sudden transferred and I never heard why he left in his own words but after seeing everyone else leave I think I know why but he had the most experience at QB. After he left all we had was Frank, a walk on and Lil Doug.

And the stats for Rivers didn't tell the whole story. He didn't cripple the offense and he gave us a chance at scoring. He was the type of guy that year who didn't have good numbers but he gave you a chance to win, something like Vince Young in Tennessee. i think if he had the same playing time and played in the same situations as DJ he would do better based off what I saw outside the box score stats.
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"Little General" Carrothers left after an incident which if handled differently could have kept him at GSU. Rivers was usually put in the game when DJ made a mistake. Doug would get in DJ's ass then after 2 or 3 plays put DJ back in. Rivers really had no time to truly warm up in the game. Another point of reference I don't think Doug really knew how to coach a mobile QB. Randy Hynes was a football freak of nature. Melvin Spears was the offensive coordinator who organized that offensive scheme. Also, it was Melvin Spears who pushed the recruitment of Bruce Eugene. I think if Doug would not have left the first time and maintained the same coaching staff hell....who knows what level we would be on....

That SCG we won during Doug's first year was off a fluke season. Shit everybody was bad that year in the SWAC. DJ would toss the ball in the air and SUPER MARIO would catch it.

Also, didn't Super Mario come from an intramural team and walked on and earned a scholarship?

Let's be honest with ourselves...the media loves Doug period. As far football Doug is and will forever be an ICON whether folks like it or not. Doug is one of the Top 10 players to come out of GSU. Doug is probably the second most successful coach at GSU at the present time.

With all of that Doug should HELP the university as much as possible because of this:

1. The president who fired him is no longer here.
2. The AD is no longer here.
3. The ULS Board President is no longer in her position.

Let it go Doug and support GSU. The article has a great historical content but the end of it is what people will remember.
 
The Founder said:
"Little General" Carrothers left after an incident which if handled differently could have kept him at GSU. Rivers was usually put in the game when DJ made a mistake. Doug would get in DJ's ass then after 2 or 3 plays put DJ back in. Rivers really had no time to truly warm up in the game. Another point of reference I don't think Doug really knew how to coach a mobile QB. Randy Hynes was a football freak of nature. Melvin Spears was the offensive coordinator who organized that offensive scheme. Also, it was Melvin Spears who pushed the recruitment of Bruce Eugene. I think if Doug would not have left the first time and maintained the same coaching staff hell....who knows what level we would be on....

That SCG we won during Doug's first year was off a fluke season. Shit everybody was bad that year in the SWAC. DJ would toss the ball in the air and SUPER MARIO would catch it.

Also, didn't Super Mario come from an intramural team and walked on and earned a scholarship?

Let's be honest with ourselves...the media loves Doug period. As far football Doug is and will forever be an ICON whether folks like it or not. Doug is one of the Top 10 players to come out of GSU. Doug is probably the second most successful coach at GSU at the present time.

With all of that Doug should HELP the university as much as possible because of this:

1. The president who fired him is no longer here.
2. The AD is no longer here.
3. The ULS Board President is no longer in her position.

Let it go Doug and support GSU. The article has a great historical content but the end of it is what people will remember.
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Thanks for the insight on the situation. As for Mario, i'm not sure how he came about but I'm glad he did. I'm not a Doug hater but I didnt like his last go round with us. DJ was a true G-MAN at heart but I just don't think it was his time at GSU. Doug could bring in some talent and I think if his son never was the QB he would still be there and the team wouldn't have fell off like we did but everything happens for a reason and I hope he does let it rest. His name alone could influence more people into coming to Grambling.
 
Hardwork454 said:
Thanks for the insight on the situation. As for Mario, i'm not sure how he came about but I'm glad he did. I'm not a Doug hater but I didnt like his last go round with us. DJ was a true G-MAN at heart but I just don't think it was his time at GSU. Doug could bring in some talent and I think if his son never was the QB he would still be there and the team wouldn't have fell off like we did but everything happens for a reason and I hope he does let it rest. His name alone could influence more people into coming to Grambling.
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You are indeed a Doug hater anytime you discredit the man for winning a Conference Championship. I don't care how ugly the season was, what car he drove in with, what color his pants were, and who left what when and where. The man won another SWAC title with a new team. Talent or not, that is not an easy thing to do. Just ask the many of other teams who don't win titles on a regular basis. Do claim a ride on a 9-3 Broadway team is crazy when the season was saved by a flag football star.

Like I said before, I wasn't in favor of Doug's second shot at the job, but to bash a man like all of his SWAC titles were flukes are outright hating or pure ignorance. The 2000 and 2002 SWAC chanpionship games weren't pretty games to attend, but the title was won. Haters can hate, but nobody can take the title from the coaches and players apart of that "comeback" team.

Yes, that 2012 season was terrible and inexcusable, but to be fired after 2 games of the 2013 season was outright shameful and opened the door to other BS. The man should have been allowed to finish the season. Whatever moves needed to be made should have been made then.
 
jag4life said:
Doug got rid of Carrothers in the spring as soon as he got there right?

And that SCG was bad. But looking at the season's numbers, Rivers played a lot and had worse numbers than DJ (more INT, less TD, lower completion %)
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Doug didn't "get rid" of AC either. In fact, Doug was raving about the dude. Carrothers had other issues going on. DJ won the starting job outright. Anyone who saw the practices and the QB battle knows this. However, the kid just wasn't a game breaker. He struggled to move the ball because he tried to mimic his father's pocket style. That sh-t just doesn't work in this era of SWAC football. DJ can throw a great ball only when the offensive line is solid and no heat is on. That wasn't enough to win consistently.
 
Basebone1898 said:
You are indeed a Doug hater anytime you discredit the man for winning a Conference Championship. I don't care how ugly the season was, what car he drove in with, what color his pants were, and who left what when and where. The man won another SWAC title with a new team. Talent or not, that is not an easy thing to do. Just ask the many of other teams who don't win titles on a regular basis. Do claim a ride on a 9-3 Broadway team is crazy when the season was saved by a flag football star.

Like I said before, I wasn't in favor of Doug's second shot at the job, but to bash a man like all of his SWAC titles were flukes are outright hating or pure ignorance. The 2000 and 2002 SWAC chanpionship games weren't pretty games to attend, but the title was won. Haters can hate, but nobody can take the title from the coaches and players apart of that "comeback" team.

Yes, that 2012 season was terrible and inexcusable, but to be fired after 2 games of the 2013 season was outright shameful and opened the door to other BS. The man should have been allowed to finish the season. Whatever moves needed to be made should have been made then.
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If I was a Doug hater I would discredit his first championship also and not just the last one. He took a 8-1 SWAC team and went 5-3 in the SWAC the next regular season. I never took anything from the team so I don't know why that was brought up. If the SWAC wasn't so weak that year then who knows what woulda happened. Hell Fobbs took a 1-10 team and went 7-2 in the SWAC the next year so why would I be head over heels for a coach who got a lucky scenario. The team was not in dismay when Doug got there and it wasn't your usual go in and turn the the program around job so it wouldn't be to difficult if you knew how to put playmakers in place like Fobbs did. Any other year 5-3 in the SWAC wouldn't get you anything. Now I do respect Doug for all he has done but Grambling football was becoming bad and we couldn't even get a new QB. If he won games he would still be there. If he built a team and won a championship then yea he would deserve I better showing but all he had to do was come in and coach. Like I said you can take it as a Doug hater but I don't. I like everything about him but his last go round. If you have to like and be behind everyone 100 percent of the time to not hate them then I must hate a lot of people.
 
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