What's happening after all is said and done?
Of course Preists, Presidents, Roomates, You, Me etc all 'sin', but only some are looked at by God as 'sinners.'
huh? And which ones would that be??? First, you say you must have God. Then I say, well preist probably, generally speaking, have more God than the average being. You said this, now you say it's God's call now that we see that having God does not mean, 100%, that you(we, whoever, you know what I mean) don't make bad decisions.
Look at situation 1:
1) God says "don't be sexually immoral"
2) I mess up and fornicate
3) I repent and remeber the "more than conquerors" & "I can do all things" scriptures and try harder.
Ok,,,, and then,,,
That's one situation
Look at situation 2:
1) God says "don't be sexually immoral"
2) I mess up and fornicate
3) I immediately quote to myself the "all have sinned & fallen short" scriptures which keeps me comfortable and continue to except a lie that immorality is to expected because I'm human. Or, I form my 'own personal' views instead of following God's.
Both of the senarios you give here all boil down to one thing in everyday life; humans ultimately making a decision. Also, in your first scenario, when it happens again, then what? Ok, you repent again.
In your second situation, if it is a lie, then why isn't every person perfect? Why isn't everyone moral? It's not that it is absolutely expected of EVERY person, BUT, at the same time, not EVERY person is going to be moral, so it is not a lie given the human situation. As I said, the human mind can and will rationalize anything, both from the religious perspective and the non-religious perspective. As such, there is information beyond the religious perspective to be exposed to.
Situation 1 I feel can agree about sex because they're going in the same direction of messes up / then repenting, not being perfect, but trying & going in the same direction.
Situation 2 seems to be the larger of the groups in our society & Even contains some Christians. This group will allow for debate & everyone's 'personal views' on the subject of sex and will cause swacpage topics like this one to be created. So.......again I say
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"One, or both of them have not yet agreed with God on the subject."
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I would say that it is understood that there is a definite right and wrong God component here. Everyone knows that. There is more than one way to deal with the sitiuation, and one of them is through understanding more than the religious perspective because it is aparant from simple reality that there are large segments of the population that do not think in lock-step along the lines of religious doctrine/dogma given here.
Additionally, to situation one above, are you saying even in the case of marriage that if you, "can agree about sex because they're going in the same direction of messes up / then repenting, not being perfect, but trying & going in the same direction." that it's all good and even though that's a sin, humans in that situation are not "viewed by God as sinners"? That seems no different than using the, "all have sinned" rationale.
The best thing you can tell a secular person is that he/she doesn't have to be secular anymore so pass this on to everyone you know living with 'secular' point of views & tell them to get out of category 2 above and get into category 1 so the Genders can agree on sex. (plenty of room in category 1)
Remember, p.s.
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Come Judgement Day, Our Father is going to be very upset at how we've treated His daughters.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The best thing you can do is provide information to everyone. Information from religious doctrine to secular realities so that people will be informed to the greatest extent possible. The religious aspect can provide fundamental basis for right and wrong. Additional information can inform about what happens when you take chances, try to manipulate, entrap, influence, what the pros and cons are when you are thinking about having fun, how people are affected by going through the game over and over, how it impacts the community/society in everyday life. Additional information could point out how situations can really go bad and lead to crimes of passion, unwanted pregnancies, STDs, lost friendships. Mainly, additional information could lead to learning about alternatives, including religion, but given that people are not going to conform, and that there are existing situations ongoing,,, additional information could lead to alternatives like simply being more honest in situations that could go either way.
Come judgement day, is our Father going to be very upset at how some of his daughters have played both sides of the fence? How some of his daughters have done the exact same thing that his sons have done? Gender has no bearings on the actions of humans. His daughters are not some how more divine than his sons. Generally, this specific case we are talking about, there is a mutual decision made.
Where and when do you see God straddling(sp) the fence in a situation?
God doesn't straddle the fence, but humans are not God either. Even in the image of God, humans are all over the map. That's reality. Just look around.