Prop 8 passed


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Justin

Just an average brotha
Normally I wouldn't care for the issue of gay marriage. Then again, I don't care for marriage. But when rights are taken away from a marginalized people(s), I can't totally turn a deaf ear and blind eye to this.

However, this sends a slightly chilling message and perhaps re-energizes those on the front lines of the LGBT movement.

What's being posted is an editorial that was sent via email (no link other than an email). Hopefully this isn't a violation.

If you don't have the stomach or open min to read or comment on it, don't. But I can say this, it's throught-provoking to say the least.

SCARED STRAIGHT INTO VOTING FOR 8: Are African Americans the most homophobic people in America?


African American voters in California voted overwhelmingly for Prop 8, writing anti-gay discrimination into California’s constitution and banning same-sex marriage.

Seventy percent (70%) of African American voters approved Prop 8, according to exit polls, compared to 53% of Latino voters, 49% of white voters, 49% of Asian voters.

How is it that one of California's smallest minorities (6%) and arguably the most discriminated group in America, "African American" people, would vote to legally descriminate against anyone knowing what we as a people have gone through in this country?

It is amazing how the oppressed become the oppressors.

I think that Black people are afraid. As a matter of fact, I believe that black people are the most fearful group in American history. Our ancestors were conditioned by the slavemaster to be afraid. Christianity was twisted and distorted and used to enslave our ancestors and culture of fear that has been handed down through the generations.

Afraid that if we don't walk right, talk right, dress right, have sex right or vote right, we will go to straight to hell.

Black churches have adopted the same practices handed down from our slave handlers using the bible as a way to keep up us in check and to whip us into submission.

Another manifestation of our fear is self loathing. We see it in statistics about our health, black on black crime, prison incarceration rates and substance abuse. As a people, many of us are simply embarassed. Black people will do whatever it takes to prevent any additional strikes against us. We will even deny others their rights if we believe our chances of getting into heaven will increase.

I truly believe that if civil rights for groups (other than heterosexual black people) were left up to the black majority, there would be a new form of legalized slavery in America, a new inquisition, a powerful campaign of hate.

And although the Mormon Church (white folks) played a huge role in raising the money to ensure the success of Prop 8, many black churches in California jumped right on the band wagon by encouraging their members to Vote Yes on the measure.

When Barack Obama gave his acceptance speech in Grant Park, he made it clear that America is a multi-fabric cloth the includes gay people. And that their is no room in a progressive America for discrimination of any kind. He was clear that anyone who is against this vision of equality for all is indeed against the ideals that will make America better.

I urge people regardless of your orientation to go out and support your brothers and sisters who are "gay". They are marching today at 5:30 in San Francisco at City Hall and you have seen them in the streets of Los Angeles. Join them.

The concepts espoused by Barack Obama, Martin Luther King and Malcom X are not just for black people, they were for all people seeking equality.

Gay and lesbian people in America will have equal rights and it will happen in my lifetime.

Joe Hawkins
Oakland California
 

That bill has nothing to do with equal rights. That same bill would allow for Bill to declare Jerry as his life partner so that Bill could pass on his inheritance to Jerry, but won't allow for Michael to declare Kristal as his life partner to do the same.

Whereas most people could care less about what two consenting adults do in the privacy of their home, this bill isn't about that.

This bill was asking people to reject their Christian values, which I pray to God never happens.

BTW, did anybody tell Royal Blue that all those Democrats in California voted this down?
 
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That bill has nothing to do with equal rights. That same bill would allow for Bill to declare Jerry as his life partner so that Bill could pass on his inheritance to Jerry, but won't allow for Michael to declare Kristal as his life partner to do the same.

Michael can't? Hey I don't know.
 
So they're blaming it all on Black people huh? LOL

Aint that something, like Black people make up such a large population in Cali. LOL. If anybody voted that Prop 8 down was all those Catholic Hispanics and of course most of them white folks. I wonder how the Asians out there voted. Sounded like most folks outside of the San Francisco area were not for it. Well maybe the Hollywood crew were. Oh well. We always get blamed for something.
 
Aint that something, like Black people make up such a large population in Cali. LOL. If anybody voted that Prop 8 down was all those Catholic Hispanics and of course most of them white folks. I wonder how the Asians out there voted. Sounded like most folks outside of the San Francisco area were not for it. Well maybe the Hollywood crew were. Oh well. We always get blamed for something.

They like to compare the gay & lesbian movement to the Civil Rights Movement, as if the two are the same. What they don't understand is that someone's sexual orientation is a preference, whereas being Black is not, which makes it a big different in the two.
 
Aint that something, like Black people make up such a large population in Cali. LOL. If anybody voted that Prop 8 down was all those Catholic Hispanics and of course most of them white folks. I wonder how the Asians out there voted. Sounded like most folks outside of the San Francisco area were not for it. Well maybe the Hollywood crew were. Oh well. We always get blamed for something.

JR,

The truth of the matter is that it is no surprise that those other demographics voted the way they did. Without question, the black vote made a difference with this proposition.

My mother was a volunteer at the local Obama campaign office in Inglewood...which by the is the blackest city in the State of California.

Anyway, she was telling me how everyone who came to the office to get information or to register to vote was asking how to vote on Prop 8. Now she made it clear to them that she (nor anyone else in that office) could tell them how to vote, but did make it clear to them that if they did not want gay marriages that they needed to vote Yes.

Another important factor about this proposition were concerns about the teachers having to teach about same sex marriages in the classrooms.
 
They like to compare the gay & lesbian movement to the Civil Rights Movement, as if the two are the same. What they don't understand is that someone's sexual orientation is a preference, whereas being Black is not, which makes it a big different in the two.

Well said!:clap:
 
They like to compare the gay & lesbian movement to the Civil Rights Movement, as if the two are the same. What they don't understand is that someone's sexual orientation is a preference, whereas being Black is not, which makes it a big different in the two.

That's debatable depending on what you believe. In a sense is it the same in that both groups are being denied rights for who they are. You can't prefer to be str or gay or bi or try or les. Either you are or you aren't (finding yourself withstanding). In another sense it's not because some people believe perference is a choice outright. Both sides don't see it as simple as I do.

Aint that something, like Black people make up such a large population in Cali. LOL. If anybody voted that Prop 8 down was all those Catholic Hispanics and of course most of them white folks. I wonder how the Asians out there voted. Sounded like most folks outside of the San Francisco area were not for it. Well maybe the Hollywood crew were. Oh well. We always get blamed for something.
Well with brothas being only 7% of the population and 70% of that voting for, that's saying A LOT about the part that brothas and sistas over there played. And the funny thing is that the effort for Prop 8 was sponsored mainly by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. That alone strikes me as odd that they would support from Blacks on ANY issue considering their past and current belief system.


My take on the issue. Let them muthafuckas get married and leave it alone. I'm of the Chris Rock mentality with this issue
People always say that we can't have gay marriage because marriage is a sacred institution, that happens in the church. It's sacred... no it's not! Marriage ain't sacred! Not in America! Not in the country that watches "Who Wants to Marry a Millionaire?" or "The Bachelor" or "The Bachelorette" or "Who Wants to Marry a Midget?" Get the fuck outta here! Gay people have as much of a right to be miserable as everybody else!
. I see it as love, instant birth control, and the legal right to the stuff that people who are married can get w/o around them getting in a huff about it. Hey, civil unions aren't a panacea for them, or anybody else for that matter.

With them being supposedly less then 1 percent of the total population, they can't be that much of a threat. I mean unless people are more impressionable then they let on. Let them be with the rights that you have and go on about your business. It's not gonna cause you or I to die tomorrow. It should be a nonthreatening issue. But hey, I'm not in control of the nation's view.

After what NPR, AP and the other news networks reporting what happened, they're not gonna roll over and die on the issue. I've had a coworker of mine tell me this. And it opened my eyes a bit:
In 20 years being gay may become a complete non event. The way interracial marriage laws were struck down in the late 60's Gay marriage may be a non event in 20 or 40 years, & that new generation may look back on 2008 GAY Marriage Bans as an echo of the dark ages. They may say "You voted on each others rights?" "Adults had to get public approval of whom to marry?"
Of course I didn't get it. Then again I'm only 31. Then man is 62 and has lived to tell a lot. What he said to me was that gay-straight relations today are where race relations were in 1968. Sure I didn't get it but after the explaination, I got it. They're still fighting a fight that they believe in, inspite of what those around believe.

And from looking at this without being reactive (me that is), until that time is reached, this issue will be an issue that should've been a non issue to begin with. Give them their rights, explain if ask, and keep it moving from there. You don't have to like it but you can't run from it. So better to explain while you can before someone/something else does.
 
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That's debatable depending on what you believe. In a sense is it the same in that both groups are being denied rights for who they are. You can't prefer to be str or gay or bi or try or les. Either you are or you aren't (finding yourself withstanding). In another sense it's not because some people believe perference is a choice outright. Both sides don't see it as simple as I do.

My take on the issue. Let them muthafuckas get married and leave it alone. I'm of the Chris Rock mentality with this issue .

With them being supposedly less then 1 percent of the total population, they can't be that much of a threat. I mean unless people are more impressionable then they let on .

After what NPR, AP and the other news networks reporting

I can abstain from having heterosexual sex, but I can't abstain from being Black, which explains why someone's pick of sexual partner is totally different than someone's racial classification. Barack Obama's mother was White and he was raised by her White family, but just because his daddy was Black, makes him Black and there's nothing Barack can do to change that.
 
They like to compare the gay & lesbian movement to the Civil Rights Movement, as if the two are the same. What they don't understand is that someone's sexual orientation is a preference, whereas being Black is not, which makes it a big different in the two.

I can abstain from having heterosexual sex, but I can't abstain from being Black, which explains why someone's pick of sexual partner is totally different than someone's racial classification. Barack Obama's mother was White and he was raised by her White family, but just because his daddy was Black, makes him Black and there's nothing Barack can do to change that.

True

But that's not the reason of paralleling their cause to the civil rights movement, which believe it or not, they were a part of, at least the black leaders to a very covert degree. The main issue is they are being denied because of who and/or what they are, just as our forebearers were, and in some cases still are. That's the fact of the matter. Denial is denial on any face of it.

Denying that they're being denied is foolish. Not to mention is shows that "the buck stops here" when it comes to struggle of any kind.
 
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I was watching the Rachel Maddow show on my Zune last night like I do ever night and she and this lady who was a Princeton Professor (I think) and who happen to be black were discussing this same issue.

The Princeton professor basically said it was hypocritical and cal the African Americans who voted yes for prop 8 bigots. She either is gay and have some stake in the matter or she just totally clues about black culture, which the latter I find hard to believe...But who knows.

Like someone said, it's debatable whether it's a choice or not, but what's not debatable is asking black people or any other race for that matter to vote to support gay marriages is asking them to go against their core value as Christians. Basically what you're doing is asking a entire nation of people who had nothing but themselves and their faith and belief in God, that they will endure however long it takes this country to honor its constitution and its Christian base beliefs that all men are created equal, and after seeing that come to past solely because of their faith in God, turn right around and spit in the face of God by agreeing to something that nowhere in the bible it is even remotely accepted as Gods will or even being tolerated by God.

I get so sick and tired of people trying to compare this to the civil rights movement. If they really believed that, they wouldn’t have fought to put it in on the ballot with the Presidential election, but let it stand on its own feet.
 
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I was watching the Rachel Maddox show on my Zune last night like I do ever night and she and this lady who was a Princeton Professor (I think) and who happen to be black were discussing this same issue.

The Princeton professor basically said it was hypocritical and cal the African Americans who voted yes for prop 8 bigots. So either is gay and have some stake in the matter or she just totally clues about black culture, which the latter I find hard to believe...But who knows.

Like someone said, it's debatable whether it's a choice or not, but what's not debatable is the asking black people or any other race for that matter to vote to support gay marriages is asking them to go against their core value as Christians. Basically what you're doing is asking a entire nation of people who had nothing but themselves and their faith and belief in God, that they will endure however long it takes this country to honor its constitution and its Christian base beliefs that all men are created equal, and after seeing that come to past solely because of their faith in God, turn right around and spit in the face of God by agreeing to something that nowhere in the bible it is even remotely accepted as Gods will or even being tolerated by God.

I get so sick and tired of people trying to compare this to the civil rights movement. If they really beloved that, they wouldn’t have fought to put it in on the ballot with the Presidential election, but let it stand on its own feet.

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California is probably not the most populous state for Black gays, which give new meaning to the words in the song sung by Ray Charles, "SWEET Georgia Is on My Mind".
 
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Like someone said, it's debatable whether it's a choice or not, but what's not debatable is the asking black people or any other race for that matter to vote to support gay marriages is asking them to go against their core value as Christians. Basically what you're doing is asking a entire nation of people who had nothing but themselves and their faith and belief in God, that they will endure however long it takes this country to honor its constitution and its Christian base beliefs that all men are created equal, and after seeing that come to past solely because of their faith in God, turn right around and spit in the face of God by agreeing to something that nowhere in the bible it is even remotely accepted as Gods will or even being tolerated by God.

Most of who are doing anyway without being asked. Not to mention it would assume that all citizens are/were Christians or believe in Christianity to begin with.

This country is so not a Christian country. Never has been. If it were, the U.S. would be a theocratic republic-a road that if this country went down, it would be pure bloodletting. And given the history and actions of this country, proves it non-Christian. Then again, Christianity is and always has been an all or nothing proposition anyway. Had the book forced on me enough to see and know it.

I guess based on that above, they really are relegated (sp) second-class citizens no matter where they are. That alone gives more reason to fight, whether it's accepted by the so-called good book or not.
 
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Most of who are doing anyway without being asked. Not to mention it would assume that all citizens are/were Christians or believe in Christianity to begin with.

This country is so not a Christian country. Never has been. If it were, the U.S. would be a theocratic republic-a road that if this country went down, it would be pure bloodletting. And given the history and actions of this country, proves it non-Christian. Then again, Christianity is and always has been an all or nothing proposition anyway. Had the book forced on me enough to see and know it.

I guess based on that above, they really are relegated (sp) second-class citizens no matter where they are. That alone gives more reason to fight, whether it's accepted by the so-called good book or not.


Justin you're confusing right wing Christian hypocrites with the black community. I don't think I need to tell you that they are so not the same. The fact of the matter is this country population is overwhelmingly Christian and has always been.
 
Let me make this simple. Gay people would not be discrimated against if they never display actions or reveal being gay at all. I mean, it is kinda hard to be a incognito black person.
 
Justin you're confusing right wing Christian hypocrites with the black community. I don't think I need to tell you that they are so not the same. The fact of the matter is this country population is overwhelmingly Christian and has always been.

So you're saying that right wing Christian hypocrites don't exist in the Black community. And I'd still debate on that. People may allign with that particular faith, doesn't me that ARE. Convenient Christians is what they are. Not to mention that many people are victims of going along to get along cause they had no choice BUT to go. You where I'm going with this. Hey, I was/am a agnostic, so I know of what I speak, beyond and w/in me. But back to the topic, the policy grinds against a particular people, period. This is not solely a faith issue. It's becoming a case of have vs have nots. If you create enough distance, the issue will be like herpes and/or a hemmoroids. It'll keep coming @ an inconveneint time and have you annoyed when stressed.

Let me make this simple.White Gay people would not be discrimated against if they never display actions or reveal being gay at all. I mean, it is kinda hard to be a incognito black person.

So you've just justified being on the down-low? If you are, you've created the cure that nobody wants. OK?

That's a REDUNKULOUS arguement man.

The point that I'm getting at is that this issue shouldn't really BE an issue and people shouldn't worry about their right to marry. Right doesn't not equal obligation. If it did, everybody would be exacting them. So give it to them and walk away cause they're gonna show their love just like we do (and mostly at their own risk). So the issue is one of ongoing fire and ice.
 
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Justin you're confusing right wing Christian hypocrites with the black community. I don't think I need to tell you that they are so not the same. The fact of the matter is this country population is overwhelmingly Christian and has always been.

Justin, put down the coffee man. :lmao:

Check the edit man.:lol:. I've been brought up to go against the grains of accepting marginalization of any people or group. Hell, I'm of 3, of which 2 get marginalized all the time. And even though I'm not religulous (Great movie by the way), I believe in cause and effect and Karma. You treat someone like shit on a shingle, you're gonna get it back really hard.
 
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So you're saying that right wing Christian hypocrites don't exist in the Black community. And I'd still debate on that. People may allign with that particular faith, doesn't me that ARE. Convenient Christians is what they are. Not to mention that many people are victims of going along to get along cause they had no choice BUT to go. You where I'm going with this. Hey, I was/am a agnostic, so I know of what I speak, beyond and w/in me. But back to the topic, the policy grinds against a particular people, period. This is not solely a faith issue. It's becoming a case of have vs have nots. If you create enough distance, the issue will be like herpes and/or a hemmoroids. It'll keep coming @ an inconveneint time and have you annoyed when stressed.



So you've just justified being on the down-low? If you are, you've created the cure that nobody wants. OK?

That's a REDUNKULOUS arguement man.

The point that I'm getting at is that this issue shouldn't really BE an issue and people shouldn't worry about their right to marry. Right doesn't not equal obligation. If it did, everybody would be exacting them. So give it to them and walk away cause they're gonna show their love just like we do (and mostly at their own risk). So the issue is one of ongoing fire and ice.

I don't have a problem with homos myself. If they want to be that way, then fine. However, there is no way their struggle can be compared to the Civil Rights Movement. Being gay is a choice. Being black is not.
 
I don't have a problem with homos myself. If they want to be that way, then fine. However, there is no way their struggle can be compared to the Civil Rights Movement. Being gay is a choice. Being black is not.

kenDRICK!!!! STOP!
 
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