Knicks finally fire Larry Brown......

[Blacknbengal]

Beans, he kept some things in place. But he tried to pick up the tempo with them offensively. I remember one of the sports analysts saying that Detroit went away from what they used to be. A half court, defensive team. Not to mention the mental toughness Larry brought to team. Detroit played with no urgency this year. They always thought they could turn it on when they needed too. It bit them in the end. Brown never would allow that kind of complacency.

Now I did notice the more offensive shot selection, especially with Billups. He shot awhole lot more since Brown was gone, but it seemed to me that they still (kinda) possessed that killa defensive attitude. Meaning that they know that it all starts with the defensive pressure that Brown instilled in them.

 

[staggalee83]

The Knicks are still my favorite team.............................but they need some help BAD.

Note..........................Stop signing SMALL FOWARDS and 2 GUARDS to 8 and 9 figure contracts.

Try mixing in some legit bangers and big men for a change.

ZEKE coaching............:emlaugh: .................The Knick's are really going to be <a href="http://www.smileycentral.com/?partner=ZSzeb008_ZNxmk873DTUS" target="_blank"><img src="http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/16/16_5_44.gif" alt="Shark" border="0"></a> out of water now. <a href="http://www.smileycentral.com/?partner=ZSzeb008_ZNxmk873DTUS" target="_blank"><img src="http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/36/36_11_1.gif" alt="Faint" border="0"></a>

 

[Mr. SWAC]

Now I did notice the more offensive shot selection, especially with Billups. He shot awhole lot more since Brown was gone, but it seemed to me that they still (kinda) possessed that killa defensive attitude. Meaning that they know that it all starts with the defensive pressure that Brown instilled in them.

They still had their defensive mindset, but often complained that the Coach Flip Saunders didn't concentrate on defense enough in practive. Now that coming from players, is rare.

Larry Brown has to install a system to be successful, and clearly the Knicks want instant success, but they will be sorely dissappointed with Zeke as the coach. :lol: Larry Brown is the same with every team he is with. I hope the Knicks weren't expecting anything different. Larry came in there and said, "this isht stinks". The Knicks must be in denial, because they weren't ready to here that truth.

 

[mighty hornet]

Hold up. I think some of you confuse loyalty to being a good coach. Brown is an excellent coach. His only flaw is he will move around and will not stay anywhere a long time. He has won every where he has been. He was a leader on good NC teams as a player. He won in the ABA as a coach. Took a Freshman backcourt led UCLA team to the Championship game. Won a title with Kansas as a coach. Took the sad arse Clippers to the playoffs and until last season that was the last time they had been. Revamped the Pacers and made them winners, took Philly to the finals and won the title with Detroit. So we can't say he is overated as a coach. You don't get lucky like that, your whole career.

PUHLEEZE
Brown has coached over 20 years in the NBA. He's won one title. ONE!!!!!!!
Won one championship in college. ONE!!!!


This aint the stuff of legends!!!!!!!!!

 

[JR]

PUHLEEZE
Brown has coached over 20 years in the NBA. He's won one title. ONE!!!!!!!
Won one championship in college. ONE!!!!


This aint the stuff of legends!!!!!!!!!

Titles don't mean you can't coach. If he had stayed somewhere long enough, he may have more titles. Dude can flat our coach. You can't dispute it. Lenny Wilkens only has one title and is a Hall of Fame coach. So I guess Karl Malone is not a Hall of Fame or legendary power forward because he has no ring. Come on MH, you know better than that. Dr.Jack Ramsey is a HOF coach and he has one title. Red Holtzman only has 2 titles and he is a HOF coach. See where I am going with this. Throw in Jerry Sloan as well with no titles.

You just don't like Larry Brown is all. LOL

 

[mighty hornet]

Titles don't mean you can't coach. If he had stayed somewhere long enough, he may have more titles. Dude can flat our coach. You can't dispute it. Lenny Wilkens only has one title and is a Hall of Fame coach. So I guess Karl Malone is not a Hall of Fame or legendary power forward because he has no ring. Come on MH, you know better than that. Dr.Jack Ramsey is a HOF coach and he has one title. Red Holtzman only has 2 titles and he is a HOF coach. See where I am going with this. Throw in Jerry Sloan as well with no titles.

now you're changing the standard, because originally you passed Brown off as an "excellent coach" "maybe the best".
If so, it would be quite reasonable to expect more than 1 title in over 2 decades of coaching.

Fact is, Larry Brown aint set the world on fire. His W-L record and his lack of multiple titles bear that out.

not to mention the job hopping.

 

[D-NICE]

I think Brown is a great coach, may not be the most loyal guy around, but definitely a great coach. Very few college coaches have actually moved up to the NBA and still been succesful (see Jerry Tarkanian, Rick Pitino (Boston is still trying to dig out of that mess he made), John Calipari, Tim Floyd, Bob Montgomery at Golden State, and whoever that was coaching the Hawks, I think Lon Kruger) as they were in college.

There are also a few good/great NBA coaches that haven't won titles, as JR said Sloan has none, Hubie Brown couldn't, Don Nelson didn't, George Karl won't (but he's a good coach), Cotton Fitzsimmons, or (his name escapes me) dude that just got fired in Sacramento.

Larry Brown's problem is like a lot of the old guard, he's out of touch with today's NBA player, and if you can't relate to this new style of player, no coach is going to hang around.

Hey, if I were a coach I'd love his resume. 3 Finals appearances with 1 win, 2 NCAA Final appearances with 1 championship, it's hard to argue you against that, and there aren't too many coaches who can say the same, definitely not with a championship on the NCAA, & NBA level. The only stain on his career (outside of these Knicks), is the phugged up Olympic team 2 years ago.

Schit, I'd love to be Larry Brow though, got paid 10 million to leave Detroit, and is about to snatch another 25-30 mil from the Knicks. Who needs coaching when you can get fired and pull in roughly 50 million simoleons.

NICE

 

[JR]

now you're changing the standard, because originally you passed Brown off as an "excellent coach" "maybe the best".
If so, it would be quite reasonable to expect more than 1 title in over 2 decades of coaching.

Fact is, Larry Brown aint set the world on fire. His W-L record and his lack of multiple titles bear that out.

not to mention the job hopping.

He is an execellent coach. And I said he was the best X and O's coach right now. I didn't say of all of time.

Again his job hopping does not diminish his coaching skills. BTW, some coaches who have multiple titles aint all that either. See Rudy T.

 

[mighty hornet]

Nice, JR
I stopped counting at 14. That's the number of coaches yall have had to name to prop Brown up.
sorry, but the reality is that he simply aint done much beyond those 14 coaches that yall named.
And NOT included in those 14 are the likes of Pat Riley, Phil Jackson, Red Auerbach, K.C. Jones

 

[D-NICE]

Nice, JR
I stopped counting at 14. That's the number of coaches yall have had to name to prop Brown up.
sorry, but the reality is that he simply aint done much beyond those 14 coaches that yall named.
And NOT included in those 14 are the likes of Pat Riley, Phil Jackson, Red Auerbach, K.C. Jones

How many teams have Brown coached that had the horses that those coaches you named had?

Stopping at 14 is being modest, because how many of the countless of coaches that put on the hat, and didn't even make it to the finals. Oh, and I forgot about Doug Collins:devil2: Hell, look at all the talent Billy Cunningham had in Philly, and couldn't win more than 1.

NICE

 

[HBCUs]

Hold up. I think some of you confuse loyalty to being a good coach. Brown is an excellent coach. His only flaw is he will move around and will not stay anywhere a long time. He has won every where he has been. He was a leader on good NC teams as a player. He won in the ABA as a coach. Took a Freshman backcourt led UCLA team to the Championship game. Won a title with Kansas as a coach. Took the sad arse Clippers to the playoffs and until last season that was the last time they had been. Revamped the Pacers and made them winners, took Philly to the finals and won the title with Detroit. So we can't say he is overated as a coach. You don't get lucky like that, your whole career.

Dude is flat out maybe the best X and O's coach in the NBA. He can teach the game. No question about that.The two issues with Brown is that he seems to have no loyalty except to his mentor Dean Smith and he is too old school for a lot of these young players to relate too. Probably one of the reasons Riley brought in so many Vets to Miami. Brown other problem is that the media has become a tool for him. So he uses it. Sometimes too much. Like with the Marbury situation. He needed to just tell Stephon to shut up and play ball like Riles would have done. That Knicks situation was not a good one for him to go too. He should have stayed in Detroit. Cleveland would have been a good spot for him. Brown is a defensive minded coach so helping LeBron who is humble would have been ideal.

I totally agree. He's a damn good coach. Lightning doesn't strike 3 and 4 times in a row. But like someone said earlier, he IS a broad. :lol:

 

[mighty hornet]

How many teams have Brown coached that had the horses that those coaches you named had?

Stopping at 14 is being modest, because how many of the countless of coaches that put on the hat, and didn't even make it to the finals. Oh, and I forgot about Doug Collins:devil2: Hell, look at all the talent Billy Cunningham had in Philly, and couldn't win more than 1.

NICE

22 years, 9 teams, 1 title don't equate to greatness. sorry
:scared::scared:


btw, LMAO @yall cause I had included Cunningham and RudyT in my list, til I gave it 2nd thought and took them off
:lol::lol:

 

[JaguarNation99]

Brown is a very, very good, but not great coach, and his constant job-hopping diminishes him. I give him credit for his ability to win everywhere, and to improve almost every situation, but you can't evaluate him without discussing him always leaving before the job was complete. Of his NBA Finals appearances, that 2001 Philly team was one of the worst and most flawed teams to ever play for a championship (along with the 1999 Knicks and 2002 Nets). He got a lot more credit than he deserved in Detroit, that was a 50 win team when he got there. The acquisition of Rasheed Wallace was really what put that team over the top. I find it hard to believe that Rick Carlisle couldn't have led that same roster to a title.

 

[JR]

22 years, 9 teams, 1 title don't equate to greatness. sorry
:scared::scared:


btw, LMAO @yall cause I had included Cunningham and RudyT in my list, til I gave it 2nd thought and took them off
:lol::lol:

LOL @MH. You better take that non coaching Rudy T off the list. That is my argument. Some coaches have been just lucky to win titles. As much as I love Phil Jackson. He is a good motivator and master of dealing with egos. But he had 2 great situations. My rankings of great NBA coaches based on the sheer coaching ability is as follows

1. Red Auerbach........based on winning with different Boston teams and his run was great. Plus he knew how to beat Wilt.

2. Pat Riley...... this title sealed it for me. He took three teams to the Finals

3. Phil Jackson.......9 titles aint nothing to sneeze at.

4. Lenny Wilkens

5. Larry Brown
6. Chuck Daley

7. Jack Ramsey

8. Gregg Poppovich

9. REd Holtzman

10. Jerry Sloan

11. Hubie Brown

12. Cotton Fitzsimmons

13. Gene Shue

14. Dick Motta

15. Bill Fitch

16. Billy Cunningham

17. Rick Adelman

18 Al Attles

19 Don Nelson
20. KC Jones

21. John Macleod

22. George Karl

23 Doug Moe

 

[JR]

Brown is a very, very good, but not great coach, and his constant job-hopping diminishes him. I give him credit for his ability to win everywhere, and to improve almost every situation, but you can't evaluate him without discussing him always leaving before the job was complete. Of his NBA Finals appearances, that 2001 Philly team was one of the worst and most flawed teams to ever play for a championship (along with the 1999 Knicks and 2002 Nets). He got a lot more credit than he deserved in Detroit, that was a 50 win team when he got there. The acquisition of Rasheed Wallace was really what put that team over the top. I find it hard to believe that Rick Carlisle couldn't have led that same roster to a title.

But only LB could coach a Rasheed Wallace type. He made that happen. UNC connection. Rasheed is back to being technical city again as soon as Brown left. Also the Philly situation was more front office than Brown. So they had went far as he could take them. Actually that is the mark of a great coach when you can take a sad arse team and win with them. He has done that everywhere. Some coaches can't do that. They always need a good situation to step into.

 

[JaguarNation99]

But only LB could coach a Rasheed Wallace type. He made that happen. UNC connection. Rasheed is back to being technical city again as soon as Brown left. Also the Philly situation was more front office than Brown. So they had went far as he could take them. Actually that is the mark of a great coach when you can take a sad arse team and win with them. He has done that everywhere. Some coaches can't do that. They always need a good situation to step into.

Rasheed was that way last year too. He had 8 technicals in the postseason last year alone. Actually that whole team was overly emotional and distracted in Brown's last season.

I still don't see him as a great coach, but that man is a damn genius. He comes to a team, coaches them up, the sabatoges the situation with players and/or management, then gets paid to leave. First Philly, then Detroit, now the Knicks. That's checks from three separate teams, not to coach them. That's brilliant.

 

[HBCUs]

22 years, 9 teams, 1 title don't equate to greatness. sorry
:scared::scared:

Didn't you once state that Dean Smith was overrated? LMAO!!!

 

[delock]

PUHLEEZE
Brown has coached over 20 years in the NBA. He's won one title. ONE!!!!!!!
Won one championship in college. ONE!!!!


This aint the stuff of legends!!!!!!!!!

Name another coach who have done both!!!!

 

[delock]

LOL @MH. You better take that non coaching Rudy T off the list. That is my argument. Some coaches have been just lucky to win titles. As much as I love Phil Jackson. He is a good motivator and master of dealing with egos. But he had 2 great situations. My rankings of great NBA coaches based on the sheer coaching ability is as follows

1. Red Auerbach........based on winning with different Boston teams and his run was great. Plus he knew how to beat Wilt.

2. Pat Riley...... this title sealed it for me. He took three teams to the Finals

3. Phil Jackson.......9 titles aint nothing to sneeze at.

4. Lenny Wilkens

5. Larry Brown
6. Chuck Daley

7. Jack Ramsey

8. Gregg Poppovich

9. REd Holtzman

10. Jerry Sloan

11. Hubie Brown

12. Cotton Fitzsimmons

13. Gene Shue

14. Dick Motta

15. Bill Fitch

16. Billy Cunningham

17. Rick Adelman

18 Al Attles

19 Don Nelson
20. KC Jones

21. John Macleod

22. George Karl

23 Doug Moe

How can you leave Rudy T off?.......Wait is this haterade? Last time I remember he have two rings......more then most of the coaches on your list

 

[Robber]

You can't say a coach is not a great coach because he hasn't won a number of titles. If you take over a loser organization, you're gonna start off there a loser yourself. In time you can turn the situation around, but it's crazy to expect titles. Larry Brown is a great coach by fair and objective standards. He lacks loyalty.

But he's the smartest man on the planet. As NICE pointed out, the guy gets fired and has made a boat load of money, and is still in position to coach next year for millions more.

 

[Mr. Tiger]

Larry Brown is a good coach, Blacknbengal, but I don't think there is any love for him in Detroit right now. And I don't think they are convinced a coaching change will make the difference. They will probably tweek their roster. Ben Wallace isn't getting any younger and beside Hunter and McDyess their bench is not a factor. Then, add to the fact that Rasheed performed poorly. They will probably address some of these issues in the off-season.

Meanwhile, in New York, the Knicks will be horrible and remain horrible unless they trade either Marbury or Francis, or both. They have got way too many players who play the same position. But a trade is unlike because of the salaries these guys make. Marbury, Francis, Q. Richardson, Crawford, Jalen Rose, Zeke just went crazy for the SF and SG position. Francis and Marbury on the same team, I wouldn't even make that move on Playstation.

 

[D-NICE]

MH, hey man, I'm not saying he's the greatest of coaches, but with some of those reclaimation projects he took on....he deserves some props, and I'm not a Larry Brown fan.....man, just be ready to see him coaching in Charlotte next year. That UNC connection will strike in Carolina, they need a coach, he needs a job, and there are a few Tar Heels on the team.

If no title winning Mike Fratello can keep a job in the NBA then I know there's a place for Larry Brown in this league, and just think Fratello is not on George Karl's level.:emlaugh:

NICE

 

[Croft84]

Brown is a very, very good, but not great coach, and his constant job-hopping diminishes him. I give him credit for his ability to win everywhere, and to improve almost every situation, but you can't evaluate him without discussing him always leaving before the job was complete. Of his NBA Finals appearances, that 2001 Philly team was one of the worst and most flawed teams to ever play for a championship (along with the 1999 Knicks and 2002 Nets). He got a lot more credit than he deserved in Detroit, that was a 50 win team when he got there. The acquisition of Rasheed Wallace was really what put that team over the top. I find it hard to believe that Rick Carlisle couldn't have led that same roster to a title.

Rick Carlisle! :lmao: D-Nice I was thinking Bobcats too. JRRed Auderbach(sp) had the best white boys and brothers in the league he suppose to have won all his titles.

 

[Mr. SWAC]

\BTW, some coaches who have multiple titles aint all that either. See Rudy T.

Hell Phil Jackson should be at the VERY TOP of that list. Without a doubt the most overrated coach in the NBA.

 

[JR]

How can you leave Rudy T off?.......Wait is this haterade? Last time I remember he have two rings......more then most of the coaches on your list

Rudy T was an average coach in my opinion. He also doesn't have the number of wins that the rest of those coaches have on that list. Heck Del Harris has more wins than Rudy I believe. That inside/out strategy was something a teenager could draw up. LOL. But you are slightly right. It aint haterade. It is the fact that he was very overated. The Dream is the reason they won titles. Along with Big Shot Bob, Cassell, Kenny Smith and Clyde for the second one. I blame Pat Riley for the first Rocket title. I blame Nick the brick Anderson was the second Rocket title. LOL.

I stopped at 23. We'll put Rudy at 24 or 25. How about that.