President's Council approves Claflin, Lincoln, and Langston


Jafus (Thinker)

Jafus (Thinker)

Well-Known Member
From the Onnidan front page.......


http://www.thesiac.com/article.php?article_id=220

PRESIDENT?S COUNCIL APPROVES CLAFLIN, LINCOLN, AND LANGSTON FOR PROVISIONAL MEMBERSHIP IN THE SIAC

December 20, 2004

ATLANTA ? The Council of Presidents of the Southern Intercollegiate Athletic Conference has approved the provisional membership of Claflin University, Lincoln (MO) University, and Langston University to join the conference.

The NCAA defines a provisional membership as a prerequisite for active membership. Before the institutions can become an active member, they are limited to a four-year period to prepare their school to officially join the conference. During this time, they make all of the necessary adjustments to administer their athletic programs in accordance with the SIAC constitution, bylaws, rules, and regulations.

?We are delighted to give Claflin, Lincoln, and Langston the opportunity to become a part of the SIAC family,? Dr. William Lide, Commissioner of the SIAC said. ?We also consider it an honor that these fine institutions would like to be a part of the growth and expansion of the conference.?

Claflin and Lincoln are no strangers to the SIAC. Claflin?s basketball team will play SIAC members schools such as Benedict, Clark Atlanta, and Fort Valley State University during the basketball season this year. Lincoln University plays Miles College in a football classic every year. All three schools will be incorporated into the playing schedules of SIAC schools in Fall 2005 and be recorded as non-conference games.

Currently, Stillman College in Tuscaloosa, AL is in its second year of provisional membership in the SIAC. The addition of three other schools will bring the conference?s institution total to 15. Once Stillman is activated, the conference plans to move forward with dividing the conference into east and west divisions.

SCHOOL QUICK FACTS

CLAFLIN UNIVERSITY
President: Dr. Henry Tisdale
Location: Orangeburg, SC ? 40 miles south of Columbia
Founded: 1869 ? Oldest HBCU in the state of South Carolina
Enrollment: 1700
Current Affiliation: NAIA ? Eastern Intercollegiate Athletic Conference
Sports: Men: Basketball, Baseball, Tennis, Cross Country, Track and Field
Women: Basketball, Softball, Volleyball, Tennis, Track and Field
Colors: Orange and Maroon
Nickname: Panthers
Athletic Director: Dr. Leroy Durant

LINCOLN UNIVERSITY
President: David Henderson
Location: Jefferson City, MO ? Capital of Missouri
Founded: 1866
Enrollment: 2900
Current Affiliation: NCAA Division II ? Hartland Conference
Sports: Men: Baseball, Basketball, Track, Football, Golf
Women: Basketball, Cross Country, Track and Field, Softball, Tennis
Colors: Navy and White
Nickname: Blue Tigers
Athletic Director: Tim Abney

LANGSTON UNIVERSITY
President: Dr. E.L. Holloway
Location: Langston, OK ? 43 miles from Oklahoma City
Founded: 1897
Enrollment: 3700
Current Affiliation: NAIA ? Red River Athletic Conference and Central States Football League
Sports: Men: Basketball, Track and Field, Golf, Football
Women: Basketball, Cross Country, Track and Field, Golf (club sport)
Colors: Orange and Navy Blue
Nickname: Lions
Athletic Director: Al Chandler
 
That's going to be a he!! of a treck from from Langston, OK to say, Fort Valley, GA and vice versa. But this move gives them 15 teams, thats a huge conference.
 

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Skegee/FAMU/FVSU, can attest, I told the Onnidan board a year ago and followed up with the news of the members about 6 months ago. The SIAC commissioner and SIAC presidents wanted a SIAC Championship Game.

I heard the results the Saturday of the SWAC Championship Game and confirmed that Tuesday. Just did not want to go the board because people where acting as if I was the one who was solely responsible for pushing the deal through the SIAC Office. Shaking My Head!!

The MEAC is next...
 
Could this be a sign that Tuskegee and Albany State or Ft. Valley could be leaving the SIAC and possibly moving to either the MEAC or the SWAC? The SIAC may be planning for this.
 
My own sense is TU can't afford to move up to I-AA at this time or in the foreseeable future - we are just barely managing to stay above water now...
 
Deuce said:
Could this be a sign that Tuskegee and Albany State or Ft. Valley could be leaving the SIAC and possibly moving to either the MEAC or the SWAC? The SIAC may be planning for this.
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Now that's what I'm interested to know...As Jafus would say, intriguing!!!

If the SWAC grabs Skegee and/or Albany and Ft. Valley and the MEAC grabs Albany/Ft. Valley

That means we both can really go to 12 teams

ex. put SU, GSU, UAPB, TSU, PV, AlcSt in the west and keep J-State, Valley, Bama-Gump, Bama-Hunstville, Skegee and Ft. Valley/Albany in the east...

that could really be a saving grace for SWAC divisional play and also cutting down on travel costs..and giving the fact that old rivalies would be rekindled by adding two out of those three...(since a good deal of SWAC teams were once members of the SIAC

So if the MEAC would split into FAMU, Savannah St, SC State, Ft. Valley/Albany, BCC and NC Central (pending NCAA OK) for a Southern division and Del St., Howard, Hampton, Norfolk St., NC A&T and possibly Winston-Salem (pending NCAA OK) for a Northern division... hmm..that could help shave travel costs as well.


I'm sorry y'all...You'll say that I'm a dreamer...but I'm not the only one... :emlaugh: :headphone :headphone
 
Ft. Valley and Albany have just made extreme budget cuts as ordered by the state...CAU has cut academic programs and reduced the number of fball scholarships...

IMHO, there is NO school currently in the SIAC that can financially afford to make a move up to Division I in the foreseeable future...

Orangeburg is not an issue. Jeff City is really a stretch but Langston, OK is inconceivable. It's a bad move and of course when the expected "fruits" don't appear, the prexy council will look like the collective bunch of arrogant and stupid jack@zzes they are...and that includes my president if he voted for this BS... :slap: :slap:

I guess it's not enough that the conference is already 700 miles x 700 miles - now these idiots are trying to make it 700 miles x 1,200 miles. None of us have a pot to piss in or a window to throw it out. And yet these are the same idiots who expect these kids to attend classes and keep reasonable GPAs to maintain eligibility - but expect them to take a 2,400 mile roadtrip in a weekend.

JACKAZZES... :vomit:


Skegee/FAMU/FVSU, can attest, I told the Onnidan board a year ago and followed up with the news of the members about 6 months ago. The SIAC commissioner and SIAC presidents wanted a SIAC Championship Game...
Click to expand...

Yes, Jafus you did - no one was ACTING as if you were the one solely responsible. The reaction is no different now than before. It is just as incredible and inconceivable now as it was when you first brought it up - and nothing has changed. I said it then and I'll say it again - this is a HUGE mistake. Perhaps you'll be able to share with the immaculate commissioner a way to make this feasible for all the current SIAC schools involved since you've always managed to come up with various schemes, divisions, etc.

I am on a personal mission now to see can't this man be removed from this job...the job of the commissioner is to lead - looks again like the blind and crazy leading the blind, cripple and crazy... :slap: :slap:

My concern is not just for TU's students - I am always concerned about ALL our students no matter what school, conference, division. This is just as ridiculous for the students at Langston and Lincoln. It is almost 1,200 miles from Columbia (Benedict) to Langston. That is nonsense. It's about 900 from TU.

My issues have absolutely NOTHING to do with the specific schools - but their locations...
 
Golden Kitten,

THG Agency and I would not have problem working with the SIAC to try to put some configuration together that would help travel. We have some existing alignments that may help.

To The Board,

Are you all suggesting that each of the SIAC presidents that voted to support this measure of expansion did not consider the travel arrangements and expenditures associated most importantly with their respective institution's athletic program considering the new conference arrangements?

Hmmmmmmmmm!!
 
Jafus (Thinker) said:
Golden Kitten,

THG Agency and I would not have problem working with the SIAC to try to put some configuration together that would help travel. We have some existing alignments that may help.

To The Board,

Are you all suggesting that each of the SIAC presidents that voted to support this measure of expansion did not consider the travel arrangements and expenditures associated most importantly with their respective institution's athletic program considering the new conference arrangements?

Hmmmmmmmmm!!
Click to expand...

Sorry to speak for these guys, but what I think they're saying is that the presidents know about the travel, they just DGAF.
 
JaguarNation99 said:
That's going to be a he!! of a treck from from Langston, OK to say, Fort Valley, GA and vice versa. But this move gives them 15 teams, thats a huge conference.
Click to expand...

In 1994 I made a drive by myself from North Georgia to New Mexico. It was almost a 900-mile drive to Oklahoma City. That will be a lot of travel for the teams, not just team, for Lincoln and Langston to Georgia and Alabama. The move of adding Langston and Lincoln suprises me.

GK, I think with the more conservative legislature that one will see more budget cuts by the schools.
 
Consider these distances.

Fort Valley, GA to Jefferson City, MO - 792.06

Fort Valley, GA to Langston, OK - 991.91

Albany, GA to Jefferson City, MO ? 870.91

Albany, GA to Langston, OK ? 1005.41

Augusta, GA to Jefferson City, MO ? 834.03

Augusta, GA to Langston, OK ? 1034.02

Birmingham to Jefferson City, MO ? 632.87

Birmingham to Langston, OK ? 743.00

Tuscaloosa, AL to Jefferson City, MO ? 615.42

Tuscaloosa, AL to Langston, OK ? 729.37

Orangeburg, SC to Jefferson City, MO ? 918.81

Orangeburg, SC to Langston, OK - 1118.76

Of course this is provided that I did not make any mistakes in my copy and pasting. But I think one can get the picture.
 
Consider these distances (further west and further east) between locations of SWAC schools.

Prairie View, TX to Huntsville, AL - 811.34

Prairie View, TX to Montgomery, AL - 679.22
 
So, I'm assuming this is what they want it to look like for football.

WEST Division
Lincoln
Langston
Lane
Miles
Stillman
Tuskegee

East Division
Fort Valley State
Albany State
Morehouse
Benedict
Clark Atlanta
Kentucky State

I'm also under the assumation that teams in the West Division will not travel to both Lincoln & Langston in the same year or to Lincoln or Langston and Kentucky State or Benedict in the same year.

As well as, the East Division will not travel to both Kentucky State or Benedict in the same year or to Kentucky State or Benedict and Lincoln or Langston in the same year.

If my assumations are correct, that will mean only one longer than normal trip per year in football. Some schools like Lane and Kentucky State might not have to work around their schedule as much because of their proximity to the outlaying schools. Since all schools in the SIAC already were making trips to either Lane, Kentucky State, or Benedict sometimes more than one, this would give them less traveling cost in my opinion. Again, only if my assumsations are correct.

They will probably play either 7 or 8 conference games since there would be 12 football playing teams. Five divisional games and two or three non-divisional games...

This might be a cost cutting measure if you look at with the exceptions of Lincoln and Langston, of course. Now, how Lincoln and Langston will survive making the yearly trips is the real question.
 
I agree with Gram4Life,

Here is a further illustration.

I would think that this would be the alignment for all sports.

WEST Division ? Lincoln ? Langston ? Lane ? Miles ? Stillman ? Tuskegee
Lincoln-----------------------N/A--------410-------372----713-------620---------763-----
Langston---------------------409--------N/A-------591----743-------734---------873-----
Lane--------------------------372---------591-------N/A----220------230---------351-----
Miles-------------------------713---------743-------220-----N/A------58----------134----
Stillman----------------------620---------734------230------58-------N/A---------175----
Tuskegee---------------------763---------873------351-----134------175----------N/A---

East Division ? Lincoln ? Langston ? Lane ? Miles ? Stillman ? Tuskegee
Fort Valley State--------792--------991---------481----249-------305---------124-------
Albany State-------------871-------1005--------560----265-------307---------132-------
Morehouse---------------689--------889--------337----147--------203---------126-------
Benedict------------------881-------1103-------570-----361-------416---------336-------
Clark Atlanta------------689--------889--------377-----147-------203---------126-------
Kentucky State----------447--------800--------345-----410-------464---------541-------

Note:
If this is the alignment it should be noted that if the SIAC goes in the format of the SWAC. That the two divisions will not have to play each other in any sports outside of football and men's and women's basketball.

Examples:
Florida A & M University has an option to fly when trip is over 500 miles
Bethune-Cookman has an option to fly when trip is over 600 miles
Commercial Flights estimated cost $500 a player/coach (without multi-flight deal)
Charter Flights estimated cost $650 a player/coach (without multi-flight deal)
Bus/Lodging/Meals for extra day estimate cost $250 a player/coach (without multi-trip deal)

Example of Tuskegee Schedule with new alignment
Year 1 (5-1-2 Format)
? @ Langston - 873 (Flight)
? Lincoln
? @Lane - 351
? Miles
? @Stillman - 175
? Morehouse (constant intra-division rival)
? @Benedict - 336 (2 year rotational intra-division)
? Fort Valley State (2 year rotational intra-division)

Year 2 (5-1-2 Format)
? Langston
? @Lincoln - 763 (Flight)
? Lane
? @Miles - 134
? Stillman
? @Morehouse - 126 (constant intra-division rival)
? Benedict (2 year rotational intra-division)
? @Fort Valley State - 124 (2 year rotational intra-division)

Example of Tuskegee Schedule with new alignment
Year 3 (5-1-2 Format)
? @ Langston - 873 (Flight)
? Lincoln
? @Lane - 351
? Miles
? @Stillman - 175
? Morehouse (constant intra-division rival)
? @Benedict - 336 (2 year rotational intra-division)
? Albany State (2 year rotational intra-division)

Year 4 (5-1-2 Format)
? Langston
? @Lincoln - 763 (Flight)
? Lane
? @Miles - 134
? Stillman
? @Morehouse - 126 (constant intra-division rival)
? Benedict (2 year rotational intra-division)
? @Albany State - 132 (2 year rotational intra-division)

Example of Tuskegee Schedule with new alignment
Year 5 (5-1-2 Format)
? @ Langston - 873 (Flight)
? Lincoln
? @Lane - 351
? Miles
? @Stillman - 175
? Morehouse (constant intra-division rival)
? @Clark-Atlanta - 126 (2 year rotational intra-division)
? Albany State (2 year rotational intra-division)

Year 6 (5-1-2 Format)
? Langston
? @Lincoln - 763 (Flight)
? Lane
? @Miles - 134
? Stillman
? @Morehouse - 126 (constant intra-division rival)
? Clark-Atlanta (2 year rotational intra-division)
? @Albany State - 132 (2 year rotational intra-division)

Example of Tuskegee Schedule with new alignment
Year 7 (5-1-2 Format)
? @ Langston - 873 (Flight)
? Lincoln
? @Lane - 351
? Miles
? @Stillman - 175
? Morehouse (constant intra-division rival)
? @Clark-Atlanta - 126 (2 year rotational intra-division)
? Kentucky State (2 year rotational intra-division)

Year 8 (5-1-2 Format)
? Langston
? @Lincoln - 763 (Flight)
? Lane
? @Miles - 134
? Stillman
? @Morehouse - 126 (constant intra-division rival)
? Clark-Atlanta (2 year rotational intra-division)
? @Kentucky State - 541 (2 year rotational intra-division)

Continue with the rotation.
 

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When they figure it all out, let the SWAC regular season champ play the SIAC regular season champ in the "rekindled" Heritage Bowl.
 
MikeBigg said:
When they figure it all out, let the SWAC regular season champ play the SIAC regular season champ in the "rekindled" Heritage Bowl.
Click to expand...

A deal is on the table with the MEAC for 2006. I believe it is closer to reality. Grambling is probably 3 years away from being of championship caliber.
 
I knew Jafus would go into further detail for me. Saved me from doing the work. Thanks Jafus....

This is why we should actually take the time to look at something before we jump the gun and say it is not good for the conference. This is probably a lot better for the conference.
 
For sports outside of football, let's not forget Paine College in Augusta, GA and LeMoyne-Owen College in Memphis as well as Claflin in SC. We need to talk about 10 sports total for the men and women (www.thesiac.com).

I have not followed the news on Clark-Atlanta lately. But while their finances may not be as bad as Morris Brown's, they may have seen much better days.

Anyway, if travel is an issue for division one schools, I expect it to be an issue for the division two schools in the SIAC.
 
Admittedly I'm not familiar with the ins and outs of the SIAC.

But to me, this smacks of just expanding for expansion's sake.

Just because all the big conferences are doing it (and can afford to, in most cases) doesn't mean every Tom, Dick, and Harry I-AA, II and III conference should.
 
GRAM4LIFE,

Thank you. I agree. It is amazing to me how many individuals whom are not educated and/or trained professionals of the athletic management profession can so unequivically tell others that they do not know what they are doing. They do not just voice an opinion, but vehemently can tell others that they are down right dumb and idiots of their given profession. I suppose that is why sports are where they are in this society, pure passion.

PNeck019,

That is not the explanation I received from several of the school's presidents. There were several issues and thoughts that went to this expansion scenario.
 
Jafus (Thinker) said:
GRAM4LIFE,

Thank you. I agree. It is amazing to me how many individuals whom are not educated and/or trained professionals of the athletic management profession can so unequivically tell others that they do not know what they are doing. They do not just voice an opinion, but vehemently can tell others that they are down right dumb and idiots of their given profession. I suppose that is why sports are where they are in this society, pure passion.

QUOTE]


Jafus,

It won't matter who is/is not a trained professional when their prexy or AD comes BEGGING for money to help increase the athletic budget to carry out this fiasco now will it? Ultimately it doesn't matter what those who don't have a vested interest in the affected schools think - nor those who have been giving advice and/or getting paid. They ain't they ones who will have to help foot the bills now are they? That's what I thought...
Click to expand...
 
Golden Kitten,

Jafus,

It won't matter who is/is not a trained professional when their prexy or AD comes BEGGING for money to help increase the athletic budget to carry out this fiasco now will it? Ultimately it doesn't matter what those who don't have a vested interest in the affected schools think - nor those who have been giving advice and/or getting paid. They ain't they ones who will have to help foot the bills now are they? That's what I thought...
Click to expand...

I am glad that you have thought this out. Reads as if you believe you are the only one whom has thought this out or is capable of thinking in a strategic manner. I suppose it does not matter what any body else thinks. You have already determined that the commissioner, presidents, and athletic directors of the SIAC did not think this out, do not know what they are doing, have no clue, and are idiots.

It is a wonder they are able to lead their respective institutions as collegiate level presidents. You have already determined from what you have read and heard that the expansion of the provisional members of the SIAC will be a fiasco and can not work, know matter what has been discussed, considered, consulted, or managed.

How can one be an administrator of an institution and not have a vested interest in the institution? I believe anybody and everybody involved in the institutions whether it is commissioner, president, or athletic director will have to administratively manage the athletic operating budget for the conference and their respective institution.

According to your posts if the commissioner, presidents, and athletic directors are waiting for alums of their respective institutions to financially support their athletic department the athletic departments would not be in the position they are currently in. So, if this is the case I am not sure the alums can or are willing to support any bill.

Anyway, maybe you are correct, but I hope for everyone?s sake that this is not the case. If not, God help our institutions if our HBCU presidents are not any more competent than your premise, seriously.
 
Deuce said:
Could this be a sign that Tuskegee and Albany State or Ft. Valley could be leaving the SIAC and possibly moving to either the MEAC or the SWAC? The SIAC may be planning for this.
Click to expand...

:)
 
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