Compensation pkg w/ stocks/stock options: The Good, The Bad, The Ugly...
- Thread starter Panther88
- Start date
Panther88
Banned
LOL@phatback. Man, I needed that laugh today bruh... 
hahahahaha
Man, what I DON'T want to do is be puttin' my biz all over the web. I'm going to use a REAL-LIFE example (the good) of what I've seen and even what me and my wife are currently experiencing (the bad) w/ the market (the ugly).
hahahahahaMan, what I DON'T want to do is be puttin' my biz all over the web. I'm going to use a REAL-LIFE example (the good) of what I've seen and even what me and my wife are currently experiencing (the bad) w/ the market (the ugly).
Panther88
Banned
Probably known by quite a few, but, dialogue is good for all...
I'm not an expert. I do not have the full answers either. But, I wanted to start dialoguing on this subject.
If you can negotiate to have either stocks (preferrably fully vested w/in 3-5 years - 3 years would be perfect @ this day in time) or stock options as part of your compensation pkg (along w/ the traditional profit sharing bonus, personal bonus, and any other bonus potential), it would be to your advantage to do so.
Early on in my career, this was something that I didn't do and I seriously feel like I'm somewhat behind in this regard (I look @ where I could be if I'd done this from day one). Those in the PUBLIC sector (non-inclusive of local, state, or fed gov related) will have access and the capability to negotiate this requirement. A financial vehicle that requires NO capital expenditure on your behalf, but, on the corps' behalf is a true positive. Especially what could potentially be a positive long haul asset which could be cashed in as needed.
I did start to request stocks/options after leaving my 2nd job (defense contractor) which were not major (a few hundred shares over a 3-5 year period). If the co. were to benefit greatly, I wanted to ensure that outside of the 'normal' and regular compensation schedule, I too would share in those MAJOR profits that the co. would sustain as well w/out investing my own capital. There was a case where the stocks that I held onto split and subsequently split again over a 2.5 year span due to a major merger and an acquisition. Very favorable and to my advantage as I did leave the corp after I was 100% vested over a 2 year period. So, I'm now working in another corp w/ stock ownership in another corp that quadrupled over a short period of time (sold some shares and kept some).
Now, what I did 4 years ago I think isn't "normal" and is probably crazy, but, the offer that I was given was even crazier. Upon entering this current corp, I have/had several contacts that I knew were planning to start a "start-up" dot com corp that dealt w/ a 3.5 billion dollar e-commerce application. What they desired were very senior developers who could crank code very fast and efficiently over a 6 month span due to their tight time-lines. The financial backing by Tivoli, MCI, Microsoft, an Israeli bank, ... were there, so, ... Part of their compensatory offering were 10,000 stock options (fully vested after only 6 months) purchased INTERNALLY @ only 32 cents per share. The company was privately held and had quickly anticipated either going public as well as being purchased by Microsoft or Tivoli software as part of their e-business offering. I took an 11 month leave-of-absence from this current corp and started to work full-time w/ the startup and basically stayed w/ them for 6 months and one week (long enough to become 100% vested). The dot com startup went public @ only 4.25$ per share no more than 2 mos after I left. Mind you, this startup had only 13 full-timers (inclusive of self) and they'd anticipated that every one of us would be on the beach in Jamaica in exactly one year retired for life as millionaires when Microsoft would purchase us as a seperately held corp w/ stock prices near or at Microsoft's level. The funding started to dwindle (why I left) while the work-load increased (sweat shop) dramatically. They went belly-up no more than 5 mos after I left. I was able to sell off all of my options @ 5.78 per share before the corp went belly-up. Cha-ching.... I used the capital to purchase a small amt of other stock which promoted diversification of my OWN portfolio as well as purchase a Ford crew-cab dually for my mother's bday a few years ago (that's what she wanted so don't laugh - LOL; she said she couldn't spell Mercedes and didn't know what SUV stood for :emlaugh: ). It's my understanding that the Highland Park attny who owned the corp took a 27 million dollar loss and is faring quite well from it thanks to all of us tax payers. It was a positive experience for everyone involved. This was a good or bad situation depending on which side of the fence you're looking @ it from.
The ugly? In the current corp, I have some options that were purchased @ 29.60$ per share on my behalf. Since being split off as independant, our share price has hovered @ ~15-16$ per share. If we hit, we'll hit big, but, due to everything that's going on in the downfall of telecomm, we won't see 'big-blue' type numbers (~ > 95$ per share - as of today). It's already been 2 years since I've been fully vested and I cannot sell a friggin' thing. Options normally have an expiration date on them. I've already gone through 3 years of a 10 year offering and we're not getting better (hiring freezes, layoffs, offering of new multi-billion $ svcs, ...). True, I haven't spent anything out of my own pocket, but, I did plan to. LOL I'll spread my neighbor's biz over the web. He has approx 5,000 stock options issued by MCI Worldcom @ ~44+$ per share. Today, they opened @ 12.88$ per share (which they've even dipped lower to ~9$ per share @ one point over the last few years). Now, everybody and their momma knows that (LOL) MCI will not reach that 44$ mark no time soon during our lifetime just like we won't go above 30$ per share either. :emlaugh: I guess he and I will have to wait on purchasing those new motor homes. LOL :emlaugh: Money lost? Well.....
Concluding, if you can still negotiate your pkg to include stocks/options, it's to your advantage. It took me a long time to figure out those folx------------------------------> were getting ahead in this current game. There's more to it than that, but, this is a very good start in the right direction.
I'm not an expert. I do not have the full answers either. But, I wanted to start dialoguing on this subject.
If you can negotiate to have either stocks (preferrably fully vested w/in 3-5 years - 3 years would be perfect @ this day in time) or stock options as part of your compensation pkg (along w/ the traditional profit sharing bonus, personal bonus, and any other bonus potential), it would be to your advantage to do so.
Early on in my career, this was something that I didn't do and I seriously feel like I'm somewhat behind in this regard (I look @ where I could be if I'd done this from day one). Those in the PUBLIC sector (non-inclusive of local, state, or fed gov related) will have access and the capability to negotiate this requirement. A financial vehicle that requires NO capital expenditure on your behalf, but, on the corps' behalf is a true positive. Especially what could potentially be a positive long haul asset which could be cashed in as needed.
I did start to request stocks/options after leaving my 2nd job (defense contractor) which were not major (a few hundred shares over a 3-5 year period). If the co. were to benefit greatly, I wanted to ensure that outside of the 'normal' and regular compensation schedule, I too would share in those MAJOR profits that the co. would sustain as well w/out investing my own capital. There was a case where the stocks that I held onto split and subsequently split again over a 2.5 year span due to a major merger and an acquisition. Very favorable and to my advantage as I did leave the corp after I was 100% vested over a 2 year period. So, I'm now working in another corp w/ stock ownership in another corp that quadrupled over a short period of time (sold some shares and kept some).
Now, what I did 4 years ago I think isn't "normal" and is probably crazy, but, the offer that I was given was even crazier. Upon entering this current corp, I have/had several contacts that I knew were planning to start a "start-up" dot com corp that dealt w/ a 3.5 billion dollar e-commerce application. What they desired were very senior developers who could crank code very fast and efficiently over a 6 month span due to their tight time-lines. The financial backing by Tivoli, MCI, Microsoft, an Israeli bank, ... were there, so, ... Part of their compensatory offering were 10,000 stock options (fully vested after only 6 months) purchased INTERNALLY @ only 32 cents per share. The company was privately held and had quickly anticipated either going public as well as being purchased by Microsoft or Tivoli software as part of their e-business offering. I took an 11 month leave-of-absence from this current corp and started to work full-time w/ the startup and basically stayed w/ them for 6 months and one week (long enough to become 100% vested). The dot com startup went public @ only 4.25$ per share no more than 2 mos after I left. Mind you, this startup had only 13 full-timers (inclusive of self) and they'd anticipated that every one of us would be on the beach in Jamaica in exactly one year retired for life as millionaires when Microsoft would purchase us as a seperately held corp w/ stock prices near or at Microsoft's level. The funding started to dwindle (why I left) while the work-load increased (sweat shop) dramatically. They went belly-up no more than 5 mos after I left. I was able to sell off all of my options @ 5.78 per share before the corp went belly-up. Cha-ching.... I used the capital to purchase a small amt of other stock which promoted diversification of my OWN portfolio as well as purchase a Ford crew-cab dually for my mother's bday a few years ago (that's what she wanted so don't laugh - LOL; she said she couldn't spell Mercedes and didn't know what SUV stood for :emlaugh: ). It's my understanding that the Highland Park attny who owned the corp took a 27 million dollar loss and is faring quite well from it thanks to all of us tax payers. It was a positive experience for everyone involved. This was a good or bad situation depending on which side of the fence you're looking @ it from.
The ugly? In the current corp, I have some options that were purchased @ 29.60$ per share on my behalf. Since being split off as independant, our share price has hovered @ ~15-16$ per share. If we hit, we'll hit big, but, due to everything that's going on in the downfall of telecomm, we won't see 'big-blue' type numbers (~ > 95$ per share - as of today). It's already been 2 years since I've been fully vested and I cannot sell a friggin' thing. Options normally have an expiration date on them. I've already gone through 3 years of a 10 year offering and we're not getting better (hiring freezes, layoffs, offering of new multi-billion $ svcs, ...). True, I haven't spent anything out of my own pocket, but, I did plan to. LOL
I'll spread my neighbor's biz over the web. He has approx 5,000 stock options issued by MCI Worldcom @ ~44+$ per share. Today, they opened @ 12.88$ per share (which they've even dipped lower to ~9$ per share @ one point over the last few years). Now, everybody and their momma knows that (LOL) MCI will not reach that 44$ mark no time soon during our lifetime just like we won't go above 30$ per share either. :emlaugh: I guess he and I will have to wait on purchasing those new motor homes. LOL :emlaugh: Money lost? Well.....Concluding, if you can still negotiate your pkg to include stocks/options, it's to your advantage. It took me a long time to figure out those folx------------------------------> were getting ahead in this current game. There's more to it than that, but, this is a very good start in the right direction.
truthteller
The Critic
Dang....
All I can say is that things are gonna be REAL ugly for most people.
All I can say is that things are gonna be REAL ugly for most people.
