University Of Mich's Affirmative Action


MightyDog

MightyDog

Well-Known Member
Three white students with good grades and test scores contend that they were denied admission to the university solely because of policies that give minorities extra points.

I sure would like to advise Thomas on this one.

I would ask this questions

Can you prove me that your grades are not inflated
How mant test questions did you guess at?
How do you compare the education system that you went through in comparison to the minorities that you think you are better.

This is why we need individuals who can somewhat balance injustice.


Just reading their complaint is not worthy to be considered.
 
Bush Admin Weighed In Against Mich/AA

Hurray,,,,, looks like a larger pool of students for HBCUs.
 

Click here to visit HBCUSportsShop
wow,, didn't know that.

maybe his handlers advised against fielding questions from the crowd. it will be interesting to see what this does for his poll numbers.
 
How often does Bush give press conferences, where he answers reporters' questions?
 
Bush opposes Michigan's admission policies; says he's against quotas
01/15/2003 11:26 PM EDT


TEXT OF SPEECH: President Bush Discusses Michigan Affirmative Action Case
http://www.blackamericaweb.com/index.cfm?ARTICLEID=77624&CATID=4

WASHINGTON (AP) - President Bush plans to challenge a University of Michigan program that gives preference to minority students, telling the Supreme Court there are better ways to promote diversity, administration officials said Wednesday.

Justice Department and White House attorneys, acting on Bush's orders, were preparing a brief arguing against programs that gave black and Hispanic students an edge when applying to the university and its law school.

Without confirming Bush's plans, White House press secretary Ari Fleischer said the president was meeting Wednesday with his advisers to review the brief which is due Thursday and would shortly publicly reveal his conclusion.

"He seeks ways to encourage diversity and do so in a way that does not rely on either quotas or racial preferences," Fleischer told reporters. "Quotas and racial preferences do not serve to lift up our country and to help the average American. Instead they have a tendency to divide people, to separate people who are deemed to be worthy of something and have it taken away from them not on the basis of merit."

Senate Democratic leader Tom Daschle called it "a watershed moment for the administration. They have to decide whether they're for civil rights and diversity or not."

Rep. Richard Gephardt of Missouri, a graduate of the University of Michigan law school who says he'll seek the Democratic presidential nomination in 2004, said he planned to file a brief in support of the university's program. "I believe affirmative action is an essential tool in expanding educational opportunities to minorities," he said.

Fleischer vehemently disagreed that an administration brief challenging the university's affirmative action program would define Bush as an opponent of civil rights.

"When people view people who have different opinions on the basis of principle as being opposed to civil rights - that's excessive," he said.

The lawsuit brought by three white students is the biggest affirmative action case in a generation, a political lightning rod as Bush struggles to increase his party's appeal to minorities. Fleischer outlined Bush's philosophy moments after announcing the president's plans to commemorate Martin Luther King Jr.'s birthday and increase aid to Africa.

The university's undergraduate program awards extra points to minority candidates, while the law school uses race as one of many factors that could enhance an applicant's chances.

The president had not given his final approval of the brief early Wednesday, officials said, but he was familiar with its contents and was expected to give lawyers the go-ahead before Thursday's deadline.

Key details were still being debated, including whether to use the case to make a sweeping statement against racial quotas or rather stake out a more limited challenge to the Michigan program's constitutionality.

A senior administration official, speaking on condition of anonymity, said Wednesday the president seemed headed toward a middle ground by acknowledging that race is always a consideration as institutions seek more diversity, but that goal can be achieved by expanding opportunities to all people - not just one race.

The brief is expected to highlight a university admissions program founded in Texas while Bush was governor, and affirmative action opinions by the Clinton administration that seem to support the president's views, they said.

In Texas, Bush opposed racial preferences in public universities and proposed instead that students graduating in the top 10 percent of all high schools be eligible for admission. Supporters say the policy increased diversity without making race a direct factor in admissions policies, because many high schools are made up largely of minority students.

Critics said Bush's plan was a blow to affirmative action programs that have helped minorities overcome social obstacles.

The officials said administration lawyers could argue that the university's program relies too much on race and leave open the question of whether schools could use other methods of assuring a diverse student body.

Some administration lawyers have argued that any policy based on race or ethnic status is unconstitutional and that the goal of a diverse student body is not enough to justify using race to guide admissions.

The case, the biggest issue facing the Supreme Court this year, is a politically charged issue in the aftermath of Sen. Trent Lott's remarks that seemed to show nostalgia for segregation. The Mississippi lawmaker was forced to step down last month as Senate Republican leader amid harsh criticism from Bush.

The president must balance the desires of his conservative backers, who tend to staunchly oppose affirmative action, against potential fallout from the broader electorate if he is viewed as being racially insensitive.

Copyright ? 2002 AP Online

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Back in the day we developed Affirmative Action Plans using the quota system.

In the plan the Supervisors said by a certain period we will select

GS 11 (4)
GS 12 (3)
GS 13 (2)
GS 14 (1)

under this plan 10 blacks would get promoted. Well when these plans were not being met, supervisor were forced to take action. In fact, before they got rid of the quota system we got a lot of folks promoted. Anything that works for blacks you can bet white America is against it.

When qualified blacks started to get promoted and I am talking qualified blacks, the supervisors worked to throw the quota system out. Now we don't have quotas and they are still talking about quotas.

Under the adversed impact statement it mainly said based on the percentage of blacks in an area we should have a percentage of the jobs. (short explanation) Because of the selection rate of blacks which white males were the selecting officials qualified blacks were excluded.

Now these clowns are trying to get rid of case law and all references to those things that improved the quality of life for blacks in America. As white America watch and try to control blacks other nationalities are taking over the country.

Did anyone see Sir Charles on Talk Back Live (CNN) yesterday?
Sir Charles was so direct and to the point that Mr. Barr could not deal with Sir Charles.
 
As Jesse asked on yesterday, "what about the legacy points that li'l Bush was given to get into Harvard?" We all know that without them, HE sure as Hell would have been denied admission! :xeye:

I thought it was a valid question. :smug2:
 
He went to Yale.......

An the U of M program gives points if you are the child of an alum.........the problem is that they give points for being a minority, which is unfair to those that are not.........

Viva la Bush
 
Originally posted by The Riddler
He went to Yale.......

An the U of M program gives points if you are the child of an alum.........the problem is that they give points for being a minority, which is unfair to those that are not.........

Viva la Bush
Click to expand...

Giving points for being a minority as you stated is misleading, because when whites see statements like this it appears that the black is not qualified.

I don't ever recall a black being admitted to law school that was not qualified.

Instituational racism can only be defeated by allowing qualified blacks to reach their full potential. If affirmative action is the way to do it then so be it. Cannot allow whites to correct this issue.

All races have smart, people but our smart blacks have to complete with the below average white person. Kids Say The Darnest Things, but I say in my experience whites say some of dumbest things. I am not putting all whites down but as long as our leaders keep saying dumb things I will fight.

Suppose, all the qualified Full Bird Cols say we are not going to fight the next war until we get our fair share of flag officers rank. Isht will start flying and you will see how fast they correct the problem.
 
The University of Michigan also gives points if you are a scholarship athlete.

So is Bush saying it's descriminatory to give points on race but not on an applicant's athleticism?
 
Originally posted by The Riddler
He went to Yale.......

An the U of M program gives points if you are the child of an alum.........the problem is that they give points for being a minority, which is unfair to those that are not.........

Viva la Bush
Click to expand...

Riddler,
Bush went to Harvard to get his Business Degree. Check it out at the official White House Website.

Bio on Geo W. Bush

:)
 
Bush is a wolf in sheep's clothing.

The standards that were adhered to in the past have not allowed blacks to enter school....
 
The school's policy also gives points to Michigan residents, underrepresented counties in Michigan, underrepresented majors, etc. If the racial category is eliminated, so should the rest of those categories.
 
I feel the President is hypocritical in this case. He benefited from special treatment to get into Yale. If any other non-connected person had his SAT scores, they would not have gotten into Yale. He gained access because of his father. Isn?t that discrimination against those that did not have family that attended Yale?
 

Click here to visit HBCUSportsShop
Good point Olde Hornet.

,,, but I'll reserve judgement until I hear from Makaho on this one. :wavey:
 
Another opinion on the Michgican affirmative action case

http://www.nytimes.com/2003/01/24/opinion/24KRIS.html
A Boy and His Benefits
By NICHOLAS D. KRISTOF


n the coming battle over affirmative action, we might reflect on a case where the system worked just as it is supposed to - the case of a boy named George applying to Phillips Academy in Andover, Mass.
It was a stretch for George to get into Andover, which then accepted only 20 percent of applicants over all, and fewer than half even of applicants whose fathers had attended. Inauspiciously, George had already been rejected by St. John's, a private school in Houston.
(While writing about Mr. Bush - for of course it is he - during the 2000 campaign, I heard from his family friends that he had been turned down by St. John's, so I asked him about it. He indignantly denied the story. A few days later an aide called and said that Mr. Bush had checked with his parents and that it was true. I found his willingness to confirm this unflattering detail an impressive example of his political integrity, and it was this kind of honesty that won Mr. Bush the respect of many journalists who were covering him.)
Andover ended up admitting young George for a couple of reasons. It wanted Texans to diversify its student body, which was heavily from the Northeast. In addition, using just the kind of point system that Mr. Bush now derides as quotas, Andover gave George three extra points on a 20-point scale for being the son of an alumnus. That's a higher percentage than a Michigan applicant gets for being black.
Instead of mocking Mr. Bush for hypocrisy, though, we should focus on something else: The affirmative action succeeded. If he was in part a diversity candidate, so what? He flourished at Andover, and classmates remember that he enlivened the academy by teaching them about drawls, scorpions and exuberance. Eventually he returned to his roots, cross-fertilizing both New England and west Texas.
A few years later, in gaining admission to Yale, Mr. Bush also enjoyed special preferences. He had never made honor roll at Andover (unlike 110 others in his class, according to his high school yearbook), and his SAT's of 566 verbal and 640 math were far below the median scores for students in his Yale class: 668 verbal and 718 math. But in the end, having a Yale pedigree, a grandfather on the Yale board and a Texas background bounced him into the entering class.
Affirmative action is a tough issue because it reflects the collision between two aspirations - diversity and meritocracy - all in the hyper-sensitive zone of race. But this spring as we debate the cases before the Supreme Court, it would be a mistake to consider preferences for blacks in isolation. How can we evaluate the justice of preferences that favor blacks without considering preferences that benefit whites (legacy), athletes (football players), the wealthy (children of donors), and farm kids from Oregon (me when I applied to colleges).
I admit it: I benefited from affirmative action. Pretentious East Coast colleges wanted the occasional country bumpkin, and I milked this by larding my application essay with scenes of me vaccinating sheep, harvesting strawberries and competing in the Future Farmers of America. If I'd been just another applicant from the Bronx High School of Science, I wouldn't have had a chance. us98 It also made sense to accept me over a more qualified applicant from Bronx Science: It's good for colleges to have hicks from the sticks, to tease city slickers and coach them on the differences between a gilt, a barrow and sows that farrow. And it's even more important to have black students in those late-night dorm discussions; how can college graduates understand the world and have intelligent views on racial matters (such as affirmative action) if they've never mixed with people of other races?
The University of Michigan system promotes diversity of many kinds. It gives points to applicants from underrepresented counties (mostly white), to athletes, to poor applicants, even to men who seek to study nursing - as well as to children and grandchildren of Michigan graduates. Each reflects a retreat from pure performance criteria, and one can argue about the wisdom of each trade-off. But it seems deeply unfair for the White House to jump up and down about the injustice of preferences for blacks while acquiescing in preferential admissions for jocks, rich kids, Oregon farm boys - and yes, Texans with names like Bush.
 
Originally posted by Ms. Jag4Jag
Bush is a wolf in sheep's clothing.

The standards that were adhered to in the past have not allowed blacks to enter school....
Click to expand...

How is he in sheep's clothing?
 
Republiklans are not friendly to blacks. They speak a good game and may fool some, but their actions/policies are anti-black.
 
Grades and test scores can not be the only indicators for admission. There is a stronger correlation between one's grandparents' socioeconomic status and one's standardized test score than there is between one's acheivement during his first year of school and his test score, for example. Someone else mentioned "grade inflation"; I'll bring up the issue of challenging majors and schools. This decision removes the "underrepresented minority" portion of the scoring system. OK, but what about the "varsity athlete" or "Michigan resident" (if a person is from the lily-white upper peninsula, he gets the same number of points as if he were Black) or the "legacy" (just as much an accident of birth as one's race)?

No, this program is the good form of Affirmative Action. It's seeking diversity in a fair manner. It's not saying that a Black applicant will be taken if his test score is lower; there is still a minimum standard there. It's not giving minorities any real priviledge. You still have to go through the school, and ALL people benefit from diversity. Law school should be a place where diverse opinions and perspectives should be welcome, not verbotten.
 
Bottom line is that white people have never understood that every race have smart people. The old Thomas Jefferson System which drew the color line that a black person will never rise to the level of the dumbest white is still the law of the land.

White people don't know how good life has been to them. They keep bringing up crap and BS every day.

White people are still acting like blacks who apply for law school are dummies. In order to keep the system alive whites have to support institutional racism. If they did not then you will see a massive take over by blacks.
 
The entire issue is about amendments to the Constitution that were passed at gunpoint. Once the gun was removed, the criminal went back on his crime spree until the gun was placed back at his head and now Bush wants to meltdown the damn gun!
 
Re: Good point Olde Hornet.

Originally posted by Bartram
,,, but I'll reserve judgement until I hear from Makaho on this one. :wavey:
Click to expand...

:::INTERNET FORUM MESSAGE:::

The user known as Makaho will no longer participate in political debates in this forum. He feels that the majority of you are destined to follow the Liberal agenda towards that fiery cauldron of Hellfire called the political "Left". He has officially given up hope on all of you liberals and wishes only to discuss non-confrontational matters such as Puddin, Movies, Music and the Weather.

He has decided that no matter what he has to say, it will ultimately fall upon deaf ears. I would have a better chance of convincing Whitney Houston to put down a crack pipe than changing your point of view.

Makaho will be too busy watching that "Bastion of broken promises to the black people of this country" called the Democratic leadership rush headlong into a downward spiral towards Hellfire and Brimstone.

BTW, have a nice day !!!
:hat: :hat: :hat:
 
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