University Leveled Music.


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Legend35

Legend35

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I am very much concerned about the level of music we are playing now. Bands in the Swac appear to be more interested in volume rather intonation. I know rap is out and it's the thing now but if you haven't notice public places are playing old school. I'm tired of hearing a simple triad chord all through a song. I would love to hear a band play a 7th, 9th or 11th every now and then. Have we as Swac bands forgotten the 3 E's:
Enlighten ,Entertain and Educate ? I'm tired of hearing University Bands play high School level music. :eek:
 
I am hoping this volume thing is just a phase, just a few years ago (I'm thinking) a band was judge on how great they sounded !! Now, you have bands that play one sound louder than you ans they say that they blew you out !! hmmm !
 

Finally someone who feels my pain............

:lecture: That's the way I have felt since I entered the SWAC this past year. I have always had my opinions about the way bands should go about getting the "W" and volume has always been about the smallest bit of it. I have always felt that the Storm has stuck with a more musical concept when it comes to the stands along with a few other schools. Now that I have gotten the chance to do my thing on the podium, I am sure that the status we have always held when it comes to our arrangements, will sustiain successfully and we will also continue to be one of the major music power houses in the SWAC.

Prairie View A&M Marching Storm
TNT
MST
fall '02
 
this is true ,more bands and bands students focus on blowin as we call it and less on dynamics. the is also to much repitition in musicians write styles, i know there is more that one way to arrange a song.
 
I am for musicality. I had always listened to Meac Bands particularly BCC and FAMU because of the quality,It seems if though JSU is more musical than any other band in the SWAC besides Southern. Besides all of the blowing , SU is a very musical band, you can't have to do the best you with only a few woodwinds as far as balance is concerned.
 
I am for musicality. I had always listened to Meac Bands particularly BCC and FAMU because of the quality,It seems if though JSU is more musical than any other band in the SWAC besides Southern. Besides all of the blowing , SU is a very musical band, have to do the best you can with only a few woodwinds as far as balance is concerned.
 
Originally posted by Quietstorm
I am hoping this volume thing is just a phase, just a few years ago (I'm thinking) a band was judge on how great they sounded !! Now, you have bands that play one sound louder than you ans they say that they blew you out !! hmmm !
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This is soooo true! When did this rival thing start? All I hear people saying these days is that we blew ya'll out! Seems as if it's all about volume and not quality. I very seldom hear anyone saying that their sound was crisp and clean... just we blew ya'll out!

Are we more concerned with quantity and not quality. When I marched at JSU, our field shows consisted of only 144 members. We didn't try to cover the whole field, but the sound we produced was crisp and clean. Has that aspect of musicality changed?

Just wondering.....:confused:
 
Originally posted by PhatBoyBCC
I am for musicality. I had always listened to Meac Bands particularly BCC and FAMU because of the quality,It seems if though JSU is more musical than any other band in the SWAC besides Southern. Besides all of the blowing , SU is a very musical band, you can't have to do the best you with only a few wodwinds as far as balance is concerned.
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I feel you on JSU but, SU is not a balanced band. They are interested in blowing bands out and I want to say that they are the ones who started all this blowing out of character and other bands in the SWAC is following. I haven't heard BCC in a while but FAMU is the only one That I heard who is maintaining a good college level sound. They use a lot of secondary dominant and suspensions as well as chromatic inflections. Tenn State is another one. They have a top bottum and a middle. I love their molodic lines and chordal structures. A lot of 7th 9th...I like having fun with the rest of them but we need to get back to the basic foundation of what college marching bands are about,MUSIC. People will drink a glass if dirty water if that's all they have to drink. I will not short cut the music.
 
This is a great topic.

I guess since volume is usually one of the first (if not THE first) thing people notice about the sound of a band, it's become so important to play louder than the opposing band. When you take away volume, a lot of bands really have nothing to offer. You're left with a basic 1-3-5 chord structure, a bunch of blaring whole and half notes, sloppy and out-of-character playing.

The sad part is there are people with Master's and Doctorate's in music teaching these concepts and convincing students this is what sounds good.:smh:
 
Originally posted by Legend35
I feel you on JSU but, SU is not a balanced band. They are interested in blowing bands out and I want to say that they are the ones who started all this blowing out of character and other bands in the SWAC is following. I haven't heard BCC in a while but FAMU is the only one That I heard who is maintaining a good college level sound. They use a lot of secondary dominant and suspensions as well as chromatic inflections. Tenn State is another one. They have a top bottum and a middle. I love their molodic lines and chordal structures. A lot of 7th 9th...I like having fun with the rest of them but we need to get back to the basic foundation of what college marching bands are about,MUSIC. People will drink a glass if dirty water if that's all they have to drink. I will not short cut the music.
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U don't know what the heck u are talking about cat. As far as the set up of our band it's balanced. We are a brass band and yes our band is set up for power. Just like Ohio St, Michigan, and Michigan St. When u have the type of instrumentation and arrangements that we do then of course the sound will project. Comparing us to FAMU as far as balance is concerned is like comparing Rebirth brass band to the London Symphony Orchestra. It's 2 different sounds and concepts.
 
First of all, Your arrangements are written too high and your tuba section is playing so high at times that they are cracking the notes. Second there are no two and three part harmony within your sections. All of one section is playing the same melodic line in unison. THIS is what give you the power inwhich you are refering to. There are harmony within the band but not in individual sections. Third I never compared you to FAMU. I said that FAMU is one of the only University Band that play University theoretic music . That would be an insult to them.
 
Originally posted by Legend35
First of all, Your arrangements are written too high and your tuba section is playing so high at times that they are cracking the notes. Second there are no two and three part harmony within your sections. All of one section is playing the same melodic line in unison. THIS is what give you the power inwhich you are refering to. There are harmony within the band but not in individual sections. Third I never compared you to FAMU. I said that FAMU is one of the only University Band that play University theoretic music . That would be an insult to them.
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First off we write rap tunes high there's a difference. Second when u said that there are no 2 and 3 part harmony within our sections that took away any credibility u had. :mrt: In the trumpets, b-tones, trombones, saxophones, even mellos we have people playing 1st 2nd and 3rd parts. In some of our songs the 3rd bones have 2 different parts so get your facts straight playa. What gives us power is the voicing of the chord structure (I'm not a music major and I know that) unless we have a break in the music (normally a rap tune) to play in unison for more power. To compare GSU to anybody would be an insult because ya'll are as non-musically as it gets. You comments show me that u have no idea about how we arrange at SU. The cat from BCC was correct, once u get all of the rap tunes that we demolish ya'll with every year out of your head and listen to something else we play then u will truely have an understanding.
 
PsychoJag

I believe you misunderstood my previous statement. I did infact say that there were harmony in your band. I have never seen a SU arrangement so when I hear you from across the field it sounds like some sections (trumpets in particular )are playing in unisom. I will still say that there are times when the tuba section is playing too high. Some of them need to go down an octave and that will help INTONATION. I don't want you to think I'm player hatin on Southern. I love that band. Can't nobody do second line like yall. Yes we have some problems too like the rest of the bands. I just wish we could refocus our attention on the music and reach for a higher level of Quality.
 
Originally posted by PsychoJag


U don't know what the heck u are talking about cat. As far as the set up of our band it's balanced. We are a brass band and yes our band is set up for power. Just like Ohio St, Michigan, and Michigan St. When u have the type of instrumentation and arrangements that we do then of course the sound will project. Comparing us to FAMU as far as balance is concerned is like comparing Rebirth brass band to the London Symphony Orchestra. It's 2 different sounds and concepts.
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Before you go too far with the comparison...we know the that style of arranging at SU is very different from those Big 10 schools. Those Big 10 schools are brass bands in instrumentation, but their arrangements are written for conventional instrumentation. They just have brass players playing woodwind parts. They use tons of piccolo trumpets and Eb horns to do that.

A brass band is not a brass band is not a brass band. The arrangements make all the difference. I know that there are woodwind players at SU, but their effectiveness is often stymied due to the style of arranging. Nobody does what SU does better than SU. NOBODY.

With all of that said, Sousa defined the classic marching band and that is still the standard by which balance is defined...and that will probably be the case for a very long time. SU is not built in that mode, so it will not be considered as a balanced band. That is not a criticism; it is merely a measure against the established standard.
 
Originally posted by Quietstorm
I am hoping this volume thing is just a phase, just a few years ago (I'm thinking) a band was judge on how great they sounded !! Now, you have bands that play one sound louder than you ans they say that they blew you out !! hmmm !
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I feel you! I hope this louder than mess is also just a phase. I just can't sacrifice a good, clean sound for volume. My high school band is a level 5 performing group. But because some loud, nasty, intermediate bands played nothing but block chords at us last football season, some of my kids feel they were outdone. Sure, most of them are following my philosophy about tone. But there are a handfull who are quick to say "we want to blow on folks like the college bands do." :smh:
 

Originally posted by CTK 601


I feel you! I hope this louder than mess is also just a phase. I just can't sacrifice a good, clean sound for volume. My high school band is a level 5 performing group. But because some loud, nasty, intermediate bands played nothing but block chords at us last football season, some of my kids feel they were outdone. Sure, most of them are following my philosophy about tone. But there are a handfull who are quick to say "we want to blow on folks like the college bands do." :smh:
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Stick to your guns. The students will love you for it.
 
I feel both of you on this issue. As for me and my house I will only write and play arrangements of musicality. Some kind of way I have to push that in the students. It's getting to the point now that I don't like going to games like I use to because what I hear in the stands and on the field dissapoints me so bad. I would rather save my money and stay home. I just don't know how to make the powers that be recognize these issues of musicality.
 
Originally posted by Legend35
I feel both of you on this issue. As for me and my house I will only write and play arrangements of musicality. Some kind of way I have to push that in the students. It's getting to the point now that I don't like going to games like I use to because what I hear in the stands and on the field dissapoints me so bad. I would rather save my money and stay home. I just don't know how to make the powers that be recognize these issues of musicality.
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Part of the reason for this is that there is not active evaluation of the bands at the college level. Each institution has its own traditions and as long as those who are paying to put their butts in the seats are happy with the product, the program rolls on. The bottom line is that the institutions (particularly HBCU's) play to the crowd instead of to the profession. The difficulty that produces is that many of the graduates of those programs take the same approach when they move on to middle school and high school environments to teach and the same things do not apply there. At that level it is proficiency, not crowd approval, that is paramount. And it is achieving that proficiency that makes those directors the top choices for the best jobs when they come available.

Our local HS has one MS feeder. It is the most proficient feeder school band program in the county. It will send nearly 200 students up as freshmen next year. They are not flashy, but they know their rudiments and understand what it means to be disciplined. So, the directors and upperclassmen will whip them into the HS mold and they will become a part of the tradition of a marching band of 300+ members every year...And they will continue to produce music majors at major universities and conservatories around the country.
 
That is an interesting point. I didn't know that. We have some requirements hear but, they don't really apply to the university band per say. All they have to know are major and minor scales and most of the time they come hear in good shape but start performing worst as the year roll on because they don't keep the skills that got them here polished. It's not really enforced. But, music majors have a required proficiency that has to be mastered or they don't graduate. Entertaining from a financial standpoint instead of a proficiency one makes me a minority.
 
All I can say is AMEN, AMEN, and AMEN. I hate this loud blowing. It drives me crazy and it sounds bad. I love to listent to FAMU. As an alum of the Sonic Boom, I love the way the Boom has the power and the chord structures. I think this year, the Boom was too loud and the band was not balanced. There were too many student arrangements. What has also changed the sound of these bands are these rap tunes. After every touch down, we use to play "Get Ready." But know it is "Get Ready" when the football team runs out and after each touch down it is a rap tune. The Boom must have 50 rap tunes. The Boom was playing "Pimp Juice" this past October. Since the bands cannot play doing the games like back in the day and they can only play when the team scores a touch down, then all you hear are these rap tunes. They are easy to write, not long, and they get the crowd and the football team crunk. If the JSU football team score touch as many touch downs that hey did last year then, it will be another "rap tune" year.
 
Originally posted by PsychoJag


U don't know what the heck u are talking about cat. As far as the set up of our band it's balanced. We are a brass band and yes our band is set up for power. Just like Ohio St, Michigan, and Michigan St. When u have the type of instrumentation and arrangements that we do then of course the sound will project. Comparing us to FAMU as far as balance is concerned is like comparing Rebirth brass band to the London Symphony Orchestra. It's 2 different sounds and concepts.
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Dog, Yall are not balanced. THE END. No explanation required.
 
Originally posted by PsychoJag


First off we write rap tunes high there's a difference. Second when u said that there are no 2 and 3 part harmony within our sections that took away any credibility u had. :mrt: In the trumpets, b-tones, trombones, saxophones, even mellos we have people playing 1st 2nd and 3rd parts. In some of our songs the 3rd bones have 2 different parts so get your facts straight playa. What gives us power is the voicing of the chord structure (I'm not a music major and I know that) unless we have a break in the music (normally a rap tune) to play in unison for more power. To compare GSU to anybody would be an insult because ya'll are as non-musically as it gets. You comments show me that u have no idea about how we arrange at SU. The cat from BCC was correct, once u get all of the rap tunes that we demolish ya'll with every year out of your head and listen to something else we play then u will truely have an understanding.
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What gives yall power is that yall write the song in a different key so yall can be able to blow. There has been seldom I've listen to yall and heard chords inside sections. Just in the Bones when they hold chords.
 
Originally posted by KaTAUstrophic_Tone


What gives yall power is that yall write the song in a different key so yall can be able to blow. There has been seldom I've listen to yall and heard chords inside sections. Just in the Bones when they hold chords.
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That's a lie. The only songs we may change the key to are rap tunes. Balance is relative to what u are looking for. U are from UAPB ya'll definately aren't balanced ya'll have mellos playing stuff that the trumpets should be playing. Ya'll had no sound from the trumpets or trombones so how in the he!! are u gonna tell me what my band is playing. On just about every song we play there is a 1st 2nd 3rd sax, trumpet, trombone, mello, and bari part so don't try and tell me about something I know for a fact. Maybe your ear is terrible I don't know but obviously u don't know what you're talking about.
 
There's another issue in regards to musicianship I'm confussed about and hopefully you fellow band members can enlighten me on. Why,... in the duration of a football game there are moments when both bands are blowing at the same time? I know sometimes it happens and it can't be helped. But there are a lot of times when it is done on purpose. Is this some new psychological tactic now whereas one band leader will say I'm bigger more brassy -and don't care to hear what the other band is playing. How can we as musicians appreciate what another band is doing if we can't hear. There was a time when one band played a number and we sent over a response. If the other team scored a TD we stopped playing so they can play a number, fight song or whatever. Last year it was like there was no consideration nor repect for the other band's musicianship. Believe me I know when it is game time it's a musical war with the bands but, at the same token I feel we should show a little courtesy for one another. Two bands blowing at the same time at two different keys and tempos is noise.Where is the enjoyment in that. Can someone explain to me what this is all about? .
 
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